Homeroom with Sal & Dave Travis - Wednesday, September 9

• Hi, everyone! Sal here from Khan Academy. Welcome to our "Homeroom Live Stream." I'm out here in California where the sky is looking very ominous. It looks like, yeah, you can't—it's bizarre. I've never quite seen this. For those of y'all who don't know, there's these forest fires in East... well, we've had a few near us, and now there's some in Eastern California. You're in the Sierra Nevadas, and I've been studying the weather. The smoke is going over us at a very high altitude.

Apparently, our air isn't that bad because the marine layer is coming under it, so we're getting reasonably fresh air. But it looks very ominous when you look at the sky; you really can't see the sky. But anyway, with that little bit of interesting context, I encourage people to do a web search for satellite images of California fires. It is mind-blowing.

But really excited about this conversation today. Other than what's going on in the meteorological world, we're gonna have a team member, Dave Travis, to talk about all of the work we do here at Khan Academy on the SAT and answer any questions you might have on the SAT. So, start thinking of those, put your questions in the message boards on Facebook and YouTube, and we will try to get to as many of those as possible.

But before we jump into that conversation, I will give my standard announcements. A reminder to all of y'all that Khan Academy is a not-for-profit organization. We can only exist through philanthropic donations from folks like yourself. So, if you're in a position to do so, please go to www.Khanacademy.org/donate.

Also, I wanna give a special shout-out to several organizations that have helped Khan Academy over the years, but especially over the last few months, as we were already running at a deficit. You can imagine our costs have only grown now that COVID has hit and our traffic is many folds of what it normally is, and we're trying to accelerate a whole bunch of programs. So, special thanks to Bank of America, Google.org, AT&T, Fastly, and Novartis for stepping up and helping us fill some of that gap. But we still need more help.

So, once again, if you're in a position to do so, please think about donating. So, with that, I’m excited to bring in my colleague, Dave Travis, who leads up our content work on the SAT side. Dave, good to see you.

• Good to see you, Sal. How are you doing? I live in (Indistinct) Massachusetts, so I don't really have a— I feel for you Californians, for sure.

• Yeah, at least the air quality isn't horrible, so it's like you can go for a walk, but it is kind of scary to look. Apparently, there was an earthquake in New Jersey, so all sorts of stuff is going on in the world now, above and beyond many of the things that we've been talking about for weeks.

But it may be a good place to start. I think some people know that we have SAT work on Khan Academy; some people might not be familiar. Just give us, what do we have for students out there? And then what's maybe the latest that you've been working on?

• Sure, so Official SAT Practice is a product that you can find at www.Khanacademy.org/sat. You can link your PSAT scores if you have them, and the system will give you personalized recommendations about why you should practice. We have thousands of SAT questions that we developed in collaboration with the College Board, so very well-aligned core practice questions.

We also have eight full-length practice tests that you can take online, and we have a pile of great tips and strategies, articles, and videos. Every one of those questions has a work solution, so it’s totally loaded with great resources.

When I first started working for Khan Academy in 2016, when the SAT sort of changed format, the first thing I wanted to do—'cause I'd run my own private test prep company in Manhattan for a while—was to bring all those tips and strategies to Khan Academy and build out that Tips and Strategies tab. So, we're actually working on some new stuff this year.

One of the things that we have learned is that those students do better. These are best practices that we've learned in the last four years. If you take the recommendations that the system says, "Hey, you should practice this," students who take those recommendations do better on test day than those who don't.

We've also seen that students who take full-length practice tests—one or two at least—generally do better than those students who don't take full-length practice tests. We know that students who spend time going over the questions they missed and looking at the solution steps and taking advantage of the resources we have, like the articles and videos, and explanations for why an answer is wrong and why the right answer is right, also do better on test day than those who don't.

So, with the new content, we're gonna sort of pull up a list of what some of that stuff is that our team and I have been working on. We have new reading videos, a new set of reading videos that go question by question through and talk about not just how to do that question, but techniques that you can use when you see a question like that on the test to solve it.

And that's so—it’s a citing textual evidence question—you can approach it in a specific way. So we’re about to see where you're gonna find the Tips and Strategies tab, which is next to the Practice tab and the Full Test tab. The Tips and Strategies tab is just loaded with good resources.

So if you're spending a lot of time in your Practice tab and you haven't spent much time in the Tips and Strategies tab, I’d encourage you to find out more about how to approach a literature passage and its questions.

This is one new resource that we have in the last few months. We also have new short articles about every single question type in the reading test and in the writing and language test. Finally, we have new math articles; they're not done, all of them yet, but you'll see there are four of them about in the middle of last week, and now there are more, and we're aiming to get all 41 math skills to have a full explanation of what exactly you need to know for the SAT.

These articles include videos from Sal that are from the main content, the main library at Khan Academy, and also ways to practice. We were hoping that teachers may also use this to understand what exactly their students need to know on test day for each of the skills on the SAT in math.

So we’d love to hear from you how you think these work. Just stay tuned 'cause we're in the process of making more of them with our team—our small but mighty team.

• Yeah, and let's look at this slide here. We can see when some of the information for folks can stay up to date on what's going on, 'cause obviously, with all the coronavirus stuff in the world, some things are a little bit fluid. So it's good to be able to get updates from the College Board, as you mentioned.

We've all been working very closely with them, and these are the upcoming weekend test dates. There's already some questions coming in from Facebook. Javi Suresh is asking, "How to practice for SAT math?" Maybe I'll add a little bit to it—SAT math or verbal.

Let's say you are a student who is taking the SAT math from now. What would your—16-year-old Dave Travis—be doing? What would your next month of your life look like?

• If I were 16 years old, I’d be freaking out! (Dave laughing)

• You are not 16 years old?

• No! (Indistinct) (Dave laughing) I would definitely—for students who are a month out, it depends on how many practice tests you've taken. It depends on what the gap is you’re trying to close. But for sure, I would visit our help desk article which spells out a set of our recommendations.

We kind of spent time a few months ago during school closures on what we recommend. I recently updated it a couple of weeks ago to say for those of you who are about to take the test, what should you do?

With four weeks, I'd practice. If you have—let's say you have 45 minutes a day you're going to put into it, I'd spend three or four days taking those 45 minutes to take practice recommendations. I’d take a practice test every other week, maybe, but one thing I’d avoid is just doing question after question.

We found that students who just do question after question and don't take that time to review articles about how to do questions like that or review the solution steps for each question—like definitely use the Review tab or the Review function in our Official SAT Practice, which enables you to go over every single question that you have ever attempted in the system and just review what went wrong on that.

How do we recommend you might do the problem differently, and then try the question again? Maybe you cover up the answers and see whether you can get it right this time. Yeah, that's all (Indistinct).

• My gut sense on that, if I were 16-year-old Sal—and a more responsible version of that—probably 45 minutes, even an hour a day, as you mentioned. Like, really index on the practice, get the feedback, and then review.

Don't just keep going through questions. Reflect on why you might've gotten a question wrong or whether there's a faster or better way of doing it, and then try to redo it. But I would probably spend my Monday through Friday 45 minutes to an hour a day doing that recommended practice, trying to get skills leveled up, and then try to take a minimum of—well, maybe a full-length practice test or maybe break it up into two days—Saturday and Sunday.

But as I get close to the test, use maybe my Saturdays to try and take as close to full-length practice as possible so that I can kind of build up that stamina so that I'm not surprised that I have to sit two or three hours on the test day. But yeah, that makes a lot of sense to me.

There's a question here from YouTube. Suzanna Garcia Domingez, probably our MVPQ (Most Valuable Question) asker and MVQA. She asks, "Hi, Sal and Dave, how can doing the essay section help? Is the essay really necessary?"

So what's your view on the essay section generally, and how would you recommend a prep for it, either on Khan Academy or off of Khan Academy?

• Great question. The essay is optional, but as many things are in life, those things that are maybe recommended are things that many colleges like to see. And I have heard that if colleges really want to get an authentic piece of a writing sample from somebody, they are able to actually see your essay from the SAT because colleges know that if you write—if you submit an essay as part of your college application, you may have had help.

So if they're wondering that something doesn't add up, they might actually look at your copy of your essay. So if you feel like it could be a strong component of your overall profile, I'd say definitely take it. I know that many colleges do encourage people to take it.

As for preparation, it is definitely important to understand that the SAT essay topic is a lot like a writing assignment you might get in college. So preparing for the SAT is a process of preparing to become a more effective writer in college.

We have a lot of great content in the tips and strategy section on our system. But I would say that you wanna figure out—like, one sort of top tip is to learn about logos, which is appeal to reason; learn about pathos, which is appeals to emotion.

The assignment is—some of you don't know us—let’s take a step back. The assignment is to explain. You read a passage, and then you need to explain how the author is using elements of writerly techniques to persuade their audience of their position. There are very clear ingredients that go into persuasive writing, and we identify them in our tips and strategies articles about the essay, so check those out.

• Yeah, I really like that, 'cause you're absolutely right. I talked to a college admissions— I talked to one recently about a completely different project—but on the application that I was a little bit skeptical of, to what degree is your own work? But obviously, if they see an essay done in a kind of practical format, they know that's your work.

So that’s super valuable, and there's really great ways, great advice for practice. There’s a comment here, I'll just read it out, and then there are a lot of really good questions from Robin Schwartz on Facebook.

"Teachers learn a ton about the SAT by taking it every now and then. Highly recommend it. Studying for the SAT makes you smarter, like preparing for a marathon makes you fitter," so that's just a fun comment from a teacher, and absolutely right.

It's been a while since many of us took the SAT, and the SAT has evolved, and so as educators, yeah, it sounds like Robin's got the right idea. It's good to have student empathy, and you actually might learn things and realize you're having fun.

So there's a couple of questions here about the number of SATs to take and timing. So, Nicola Frost from Facebook says, "How many times should a student take the SAT?" and then Jesus Through Mary from YouTube—interesting name—says, "Do you think it benefits ninth graders to take the SAT prep even if they haven't completed all the relevant coursework?" My thought is that they will at least know what they are in for down the road.

So what are your thoughts on that? How many times did you take it? When is it reasonable to start using SAT prep? I have some views, but I’d love yours.

• Yeah, I mean, all the rule book is being rewritten at the moment. The College Board has encouraged—and knows—that the students may not be able to take the SAT. The students now—they don't need—many colleges have gone SAT optional this year.

The College Board is encouraging admissions offices to understand that due to COVID, there are limited opportunities for students to take these tests. As a result, most colleges aren't requiring a test score for the upcoming admissions cycle. So, many are extending their deadlines or accepting scores after deadlines pass.

So, the rule book is kind of being rewritten, but a year ago, I would've said you shouldn't really take it more than three times. Sort of a hard—like, you shouldn’t do any more than that. And you also shouldn't take it officially until you have taken a practice test that leads you to believe that you're gonna get a score that you're gonna be happy with.

• I mean, I know that's consistent with my advice. What I would say is there are opportunities to sometimes take it in middle school. That can be a fun experience, 'cause even though you might not have seen all of the mathematics yet—or some of you might have, or you might not be fully at the reading comprehension level that you're gonna be in a couple of years—it’s a great practice run and that usually is one that kind of doesn't count towards the total number you're taking 'cause you took it in middle school.

And if you're interested in that, it gives you exposure to the test. And it goes to Jesus Through Mary's question; it lets you know what's coming. There are some programs and summer camps that you can get into.

But I agree with Dave; I think three is on the high side. I would recommend your ticket once in middle school if you're kind of precocious and you're curious.

I think there's another question that Nicola Frost asks about what classes to take in order to be prepared. A lot of people think the SAT has all this really esoteric advanced stuff in it. The math is only like the core of Algebra II—not even like the edge case Algebra II stuff—it’s like quadratics and basic functions.

But making sure you really understand that well, I would say once you understand your Algebra II reasonably well—and actually, just straight Algebra I will probably get you most of it—get you through Algebra I and Geometry will get you through probably 80% or 90% of the math on the SAT and then a little bit of Algebra II.

You're good, and there aren't these tricky questions that they used to have from decades ago. They're all very much aligned with standards—not something that you would not necessarily see in a traditional classroom—but it's good to get that practice.

So, I would recommend maybe taking it once your sophomore year, once you've gotten through Algebra, Geometry, maybe at the end of your sophomore year, and maybe once your junior year. If you're kind of on a little bit of a faster track, or maybe taking it once at the beginning of your junior year and then maybe at either at the very end of your junior year—is probably, that might make sense too. But I think two is kind of a sweet spot and then have space for a third if you really need to, would be my advice.

• The most frequent pattern that many students do is they take it in March or May, and then again, in the fall of their senior year. So, sorry, junior year—March or May. By that point, you'd probably have learned the math you need to do well on the SAT, and then you might take a subject test or might have APs that you're doing in May or June.

And then, if you want to take the SAT again, take it in August or September or October before you apply to college.

• Yeah, and I'll add the reason why I tell people to begin doing two in junior years is that hopefully by the end of junior year, you're happy with your score, and you're done, and you can relax a little bit more in the fall.

But then you also have a backup if you have to take it again. Another, I guess, corollary to that question is when is it too early to use the SAT practice? I've actually been recommending a lot of folks to use the resources that Dave and teams have been creating as soon as you've essentially taken Algebra I or even a little bit of Geometry.

It's a great resource. Also, the reading comprehension work, I’d say, if you’re at kind of an eighth or ninth grade reading level, you can engage, and actually, right now during COVID, it is a great resource to make sure that your reading comprehension and some of your grammar skills don't atrophy right now.

So I highly recommend it. I actually think it's not just going to prepare for the SAT. To Dave's earlier comment, it makes you college-ready, and you will just happen to do well on the SAT and other things because of that.

The other questions—let me find—there is a question from Facebook, which is a couple of interesting questions from Facebook. Theresa Vasileva is saying, "My SAT was canceled for August; how can I keep up with my new one in December?"

So I guess there could be a couple of interpretations of that. Maybe Theresa is asking what she should do for the December test or maybe making sure it doesn't get canceled. Answer that any way you see fit, Dave.

• Okay, cool! Well, if you're lining up to take the test in December, it's about—you have September, October, November—about 12 weeks out. I do recommend that you check out our help desk article. Hopefully, we’ll be able to post a link in the chat that’ll tell you what the 12-week program is.

What I think is the best I could come up with as a strategy—a 12-week strategy—for somebody to prepare for the SAT. I’m sorry about August! Yeah, we don’t know what's gonna happen in September, October, November.

It could be that your test site is canceled or it needs to close for whatever reason, and that's one of the reasons acknowledging that the College Board is encouraging colleges to take scores later than they might otherwise do. It's the reason why many colleges are going SAT optional this year.

So if you're trying to prepare for December, please check out that help desk article, because it's jam-packed. A picture's worth a thousand words, like you've—it's pretty thorough—so do all that stuff.

• Yeah, there is question—another question from Suzanna Dominguez from YouTube: "How close are the Khan Academy practice tests to the real SAT test?"

• Great question! They are real SAT tests! So that's about as close as you can get. (Dave laughing)

• So they are the exact same tests you will find in the official SAT Study Guide, which is the big blue book that the College Board publishes. Of those eight tests, six of them are actually administered and two of them were ones before that were from 2016, but they're all as close as you can possibly get.

We have the best online practice materials and the real practice tests that nobody else has access to that. So if you're looking for real practice questions—which is definitely a best practice when you move into other test prep programs—every unit tries to get questions that are just like the real thing.

But our practices are the real thing, and our practice questions were developed with the College Board, the test maker. So, we’re as close as you can get, really, and that is free.

• Yeah, that's free! It doesn't get better than that. The best things in life aren't free! So, another quick—maybe we have time for one more question from YouTube.

Don Woodfield is asking, "Does taking multiple SAT practices improve your score on the actual SAT, or will it do the opposite? I did it myself during the summer, taking it multiple times and practicing every day—and I improved." What's your view? (Sal laughing)

My view, Don, is that if you are taking more full SATs, just taking them one after another isn't necessarily going to improve your score.

But if you take it, you reflect on it, you see what you missed, and didn’t miss, you practice, you do some substantive practice, then the next time you take it—hopefully several months after that or a year after that—you are likely to improve.

There are schools, once again, if you don't take a ton of SATs—if you take like five SATs, they’re gonna think that's weird. But if you took two SATs or three SATs, many schools will actually take your best score in each section, so that also is to your advantage.

Anything to add to that, Dave?

• Yeah, I’d say that practice tests— we have the eight real practice tests. Don’t like, I wouldn’t just use all those up. If you're an intense practicer, and you just want to take practice test after practice test—hold the real ones in reserve until you’re a month away from the test.

If you're like three months out, you should take one practice test every two or three weeks, with practice in between, and reflection on how to approach questions differently. Learning the strategies and techniques from the Tips and Strategies articles.

But yeah, I think we’ve said it before earlier in this cast; it’s super important not to just keep on doing questions. You need to reflect and review how you’re gonna approach the questions you got wrong differently next time when you see them in the wild on test day.

• Yeah, this is super helpful, Dave. I unfortunately am gonna have to cut; I have a hard stop in a few minutes.

But Dave, any parting words of good luck or wisdom for all of the aspiring SAT test takers?

• Sure, yeah. Let me see. The more you do it, the better you get, as is true with so many things in life. Yeah, the SAT is just one part of your college application. Remember the extracurriculars and your grades and any volunteer or work experience, your essays, your interview—all those are ingredients in your college application that are just as important, if not more so, than the SAT.

So just keep it all in perspective, but if you have the time and have the hunger to improve your score, Khan Academy is a great place to do it. So good luck out there, and I believe in you all.

It's just so great to have this opportunity to help people do better on the SAT. I really am grateful.

• Awesome! Thanks! And I'll just add something that Dave said earlier, which is not only will it make you better at SAT—the way that the practice in front of the SAT is designed—these are skills you're gonna need in college.

So regardless of what happens on the SAT, this will just make you more likely to succeed, frankly in high school and in college.

So I completely agree with that. I also agree with Dave; like, the more that you make something big in your mind, the more that'll stress you out, and it actually might undermine your performance.

So I highly recommend mindfulness, doing what you need to do, focus on the process, and then the results will be what they are. Don't define yourself by that. It is part of your college application; it does not define who you are as a human being.

Obviously, this is all under the Khan Academy umbrella, but I can toot our collective horn because Dave and the team and many others have done the bulk of the work here—that it really is an incredible resource.

I highly recommend it. We have efficacy studies that improve student outcomes. There are things that cost thousands of dollars that have no efficacy studies behind them, and this is free, and it's done with the College Board.

I'll also throw out a completely separate project from Khan Academy, but one that I've been helping out with advising called schoolhouse.world, which is also not going to be doing live SAT tutoring from volunteers for anyone who might need it.

So what I would recommend is—do everything Dave mentioned—put that 45 minutes to an hour a day, do the recommended practice, try to level up skills on the weekends, don’t use up all your practice tests, but start spacing them out as you get closer to the test.

And then if you have questions in specific domains, you can actually get free live group tutoring sessions on www.schoolhouse.world.

Once again, that's a separate project from Khan Academy—disclaimer necessarily it's a startup; it's not as polished as everything we have on Khan Academy, but it's worth looking into.

So Dave, thanks so much for answering these questions, and I'll—yeah, and thanks to everyone else for joining.

Always a fun conversation. Please join us tomorrow—we're gonna have David Banks, founder of the Eagle Academy—which speaks, "Empowering at-risk young men to learn, succeed, and develop character."

So we're really excited about having that conversation. Tomorrow it’s a really impressive school or set of schools that David has founded and now leads.

So I will see you tomorrow.