DO THIS To Turn $30,000 Into $3,000,000! | Kevin O'Leary & Sam Sheffer

[Music] Hey everybody, Mr. Wonderful here with another episode of Ask Mr. Wonderful. You know I gotta be honest with you, it's my favorite show! I love it because it's your questions that make it happen. And today we're gonna take a little drive down a tech alley with an amazing guy who's gonna be really useful in answering some of these questions. So let's not waste any time; we're gonna jump right into it. Everybody meet Sam Schieffer!

Hello!

That's it? That's all you got? I'm waiting for you, Kevin! You're driving the bus here!

I got it! I want to know, Sam, where you came from. Everybody does! What makes you special in the tech world? How'd you get these followers? What's the story on your journey into YouTube, and why do you love tech so much? Those are multiple questions! Fast on your feet when you're working with me!

Alright, give me like two minutes. I'm from New Jersey, born and raised. I come from a relatively big family; I've got an older brother and two younger brothers. Growing up, we had video games in the house, computers... I remember burning CDs, using Napster early on, Kazaa, LimeWire... all of those things.

Using Napster illegally? Shame on you!

That's right! Just being really on the Internet in the sort of early and late 90s. And I remember getting on Twitter relatively early. I somehow landed a job at a website called Engadget when I was 19 years old. I worked at Engadget for two years remotely, and then all the editors left Engadget to start a new website called The Verge in 2011. I was a team of one running social media for The Verge. It's very early on in the social media game.

Yeah, yeah! It's been interesting to watch the last decade. I remember there was a time where people thought Twitter was not gonna last, and now Twitter is one of the most important platforms of our life. Then from The Verge, I started dabbling in video a little bit. My dad actually used to have camcorders around the house all the time, so I've been exposed to cameras basically my whole life.

And really, when I was at The Verge, I kind of just volunteered myself. We did a daily tech news show called 90 Seconds on The Verge, and every day I would volunteer to film the show because, you know, I love tech news.

And you were shooting on what? Old videotape?

Hey, yeah, right! We were shooting on, I think, Canon C100. I personally was never really behind the cameras; I was always in front of the camera, which was nice. Then from The Verge, I worked at Mashable. I was there from 2015 to 2017. I ran our Snapchat Discover channel, so we had a tech-focused Snapchat. It was like a Snapchat-only show, and that was kind of crazy because we'd make a dozen pieces of content every day, Kevin, and then they would disappear after 24 hours, 7 days a week for a long time.

But that was the format; not only were you gonna do it that way, I guess, but you somehow found a way to stay engaged with people that want to hear what you've got!

Definitely! It's interesting. I don’t really consider myself huge. I have friends with literally millions of followers on Instagram and Twitter, and tens of millions on YouTube. I think that people that follow me are sort of in it for the long journey. Some of my audience knows me from when I was literally 21, 22 years old working at Engadget and The Verge; some people only know me from YouTube.

But when you consider yourself, though, a social media entrepreneur? Because you're trying to use these platforms in a way that you can monetize them.

Yeah, yeah! And you know, in some ways, if you go back just 20 years, everybody wanted to be a rock star, and everybody wants to be a YouTuber. You think about the same desire— not everybody makes it. What do you think differentiates...? So let's call it, let's call the hurdle. It's not easy to get 50,000 subs, or subscribers. It's not easy to get 100,000. It's nearly impossible to get a million, and that's what it takes over time to live off YouTube and have a successful entrepreneurial business.

That's right! What differentiates the winners and the losers? Let's just take one platform—let's just go YouTube for a minute here because we're on this platform right now. How is it determined who gets the light to shine on them and the rest stay in the darkness?

I think there are a couple of facets that go into this. Consistency is really, really important.

I think when you say consistency, does that mean a time to release every week? Does it mean the quality every week?

Yes! I think it's a combination of just upload a damn video to YouTube and continue to upload videos to YouTube. You know, they're huge time commitments for anybody that wants to go down that road.

Yes! And I think that part of it mentally, you need to go into it with—you know, like obviously if you're trying to make a business out of it, that's a great angle, but you need to find enjoyment out of it. If it starts to feel like a burden on you, I think that's the dream of YouTube! Or you can find a passion, a topic matter you love, like tech for you, and all of a sudden get a following. Just like a band has a following. In the old days, you had to sell albums to your band, you know, fans, and here you are building up a franchise of people that want to care about you, give a damn what you think, number two, trust what you say, and see consistently get content from you and a quality they're used to.

That sounds like the magic to make it work!

So, I have a very specific good anecdote for you. So I publish not as often as I should.

And what is that? What's the frequency at this point?

Kevin, I would say it's like I try to hit once a week, but realistically it's like twice a month. But I've very much like upped the quality where, if you go back to my older videos, the audio is not as good... I used to only shoot in 1080; now I only shoot in 4K, and it really makes a difference. But the consistency aspect—I remember early 2019, I was just going super hard on YouTube, just like getting really consistent. I had a—it's nice to have like when you have like two in the hopper, three in the hopper, where you're ahead of schedule. Where you have two videos ready to go with a bow on them and you can publish them whenever you want. That's the dream if you can.

That is!

I basically work with one of my younger brothers, who's also my roommate. He quit his job in banking to help me make YouTube videos.

And is he eating protein?

He is! He definitely makes protein shakes on some well, but we've had a really good 2019. There was one video; the whole point I'm making, Kevin, is it usually just takes one single video that could really put you on the map. So I made a video called Instagram story hacks—five things you probably didn't know you can do. Instagram is just so hot where there's so many people just searching on YouTube because YouTube is the second largest search engine in the world, second to Google. Enough people are searching Instagram story tricks, Instagram story hacks, so I hit it good with SEO in the title and the tags, and it got like 30 or 40 thousand views in like two or three days.

So I was like, "Alright, cool!" I had like, I don't know, 180,000 subscribers, and in one week, it just shot up in the YouTube algorithm. That video is five and a half million views, and I've gained 49 thousand subscribers from a single video.

So there is a music analogy to that; it takes one big hit to get your band on the map, and then people want to listen to what else you've got!

It's a great analogy to YouTube. Let's jump into some questions because I've got a whole ton of questions here.

Tech origins, your beginning, you're gonna be the right guy to co-author these answers with me, which is what I love to do in collaborations. We have a lot of fun! So let's listen to what these people are asking and think about how we can help them advance their cause because everybody asks these questions for a reason. They're trying to do something better, faster—a business and entrepreneur decide if they want to actually get into something in terms of a new idea in tech. Everything in tech has been done before, it seems, until the next big idea comes along.

So let's start with this. This is from Charlie. Charlie, what do you got for us?

Hey Mr. Wonderful! We're rapidly entering the age of autonomous cars. Do you think car ownership will continue to be a priority for most, or do you see people preferring to use them as needed via a subscription service?

Hmm, you know that's a great question! There's a lot he's insinuating. A lot! What he's basically saying is if everybody's willing to jump in an autopilot car, why should you own it? So let's start with you. What do you think about this question? Because it has a lot of implications on how you would invest in car companies, a la Tesla, which is a hot stock right now.

What do you think? What's the answer to Charlie's question?

There's a lot to unpack here! I am, first of all, extremely bullish on Tesla! Elon has now completed part one of his master plan. I think that I am personally a little bit in my own bubble because I've lived in Manhattan for about seven years now, and I haven't... You know, I really don't own...

Those are the Manhattan police sirens I hear that they're constantly... There's noise here! So like my use for a car—I've rode here on an electric longboard. My use for a car is effectively zero right now! Like I wouldn't... I did pre-order Cybertruck because I don't know where I'm gonna be when I think ships in two or three years. But I think that in terms of autonomous vehicles, we are definitely—and I hope—going toward a future where cars drive themselves.

I make this analogy with sort of naysayers that are like "the cars can be hacked" and this and that. I say when you pick up your phone to call your mom or your cousin or your boss and you send a text message or an email, you're not worried about someone intercepting that call. You're not worried about something getting hacked. Yes, there is a chance that something catastrophic could happen, but I think traffic deaths in the U.S. alone in 2017 or 2018 was like upwards of 35,000. You think those are gonna way down once cars are watching themselves?

Yes, I think so! I agree with that! Do you own and operate an electric vehicle?

I do, and I'll tell you my answer to this question comes from experience. Yes, in a rather different way! My son's an electrical engineer in his third year. He decides to take an internship at Tesla. We're sitting at the kitchen table; he gets invited, he accepts—he's really interested because he was on the car team at his college! And a lot of people don't know this: every cohort—engineering electrical engineers race F1 formula cars they built from scratch against each other. MIT generally would beat everybody, but in this particular Nebraska race, Trevor, who was the captain of the team, beat MIT.

Now, of course, at all these races, the test guys and all the BMW guys and the Audi guys and the Ford guys are running around meeting these teams. So his team did very well; he's not sort of a battery management side; he got an internship. But here's the story—we're sitting at the kitchen table, I'm looking over at my screen because I manage, you know, I'm in the financial services industry with ETFs, and I'm looking over and Tesla's down 13% because they missed a quarter, or an analyst said too short the stock or whatever. I said to Trevor, "This company looks like a dog! This thing is down so much!"

He said, "Dad, nobody understands this company! This is not a car company; it's a data company. It has the highest resolution of miles driven on earth. Every time a Tesla drives, it reports back to HQ and makes the resolution of that road even clearer for future autonomous driving!" I said, "What does that mean, Trevor? Should I not think if this is a car company?" He said, "No! Think about it as a data company—with extremely high-resolution data, and you should own some!"

So I bought some stock. You know, this is the highest return on any stock I own because that was the low that day, just by happenchance. And I'm up, like, I don't know, 90%! And it's the car company—barely makes any money! This is why I always listen to people that know more about something than I do, and Trevor clearly understood that he had a different vision for what Tesla was. He loved working there!

But to me, that is the future, and boy, am I glad I own that stock! And to Elon, who I saw recently out in LA, I thanked him! I said, "Listen, Elon, all I know about you is you've made me money!" Hahaha!

And that's a good guy!

It is! Great! But let's move on. I think you said it—we're both pretty positive on that! Thank you for your question, Charlie! I love the randomness of these questions; I just never know what gets pretty broad these days!

I'd say Michel is asking this question.

I'm so wonderful! I have a question for you. If you had $30,000 in the bank stored up from my savings that you have as a student working, would you invest at all, or would you do the 10% everyone—the best only 10% of it and only invest 10% for income over time? Should I save it for my graduate school or invest it?

Sam, tough question! $30,000 per student—he's not even in debt! But he's going to go into debt if he goes to second post-secondary college.

Right! That is a really tough question to answer!

Ouu, take it first! I wanna hear us!

It's very simple for me—I hate debt, Michelle! I hate debt! I can't stand debt! If you have $30,000 invested in yourself in college, don't go into debt while you're in college! Do what I did—get a job at night! I was slinging beer and I worked as a chef just so I never got into debt in college! I hate that!

But I would not invest it until you're finished your journey. I look at it this way: you should make a decision—if you're gonna take thirty thousand dollars that are in the bank right now, you better invest in a degree that makes sense in terms of monetizing it. And I've said this many times. I get criticized for it all the time—the top three for me: engineering, number one. Engineering, number two. And engineering, number three. And if you want a fourth choice, go with engineering! Because if you have the aptitude to do that, the chances you won't be employed are practically zero, and you'll make lots of money. Everything else, I don't know—it's hard to say.

What do you think, Sam?

This might sound a little crazy, but I don’t think $30,000 is that much in the grand scheme of things! Like, if you don't have it? Yes! But if this person is thinking in sort of ten years from now, hopefully, they're gonna have much more than thirty thousand—not a... It should make seven percent a year if it's invested in the market. The question is: should you go in debt instead of using that to get—invest in your own education? And here's another further question—if you don't really believe in your education that you would invest in it, what the hell are you doing?

That's right!

That's right! I think, Michelle, should take it upon himself to, you know, ask himself what does he really want? If he's okay with investing thirty thousand into himself—you said to pursue the education—then hopefully he'll be able to make a ton more money that he can recoup that debt if need be.

Are you okay with—let's say you had three kids and they all want to do history and the liberal arts and pursue music, and you're still paying for all of their lives? I mean, this is a very touchy question!

Yeah, people feel... I'm not against the arts at all, but you have to have a plan that you can actually separate from your parents by the time you're 18 and make it on your own!

What's the strategy?

You know what's funny? This is just speaking solely from my perspective—you found a way! I really didn't have a plan, frankly!

Your father still writing you a check every week?

No, no, no! My parents—I haven't really taken money for my... They pay for my phone bill, and that's literally it! I've been paying rent for, yeah, probably seven years now!

You're financially independent!

Oh yes! Super financially independent! You're in my mind every week—you're thinking about how do I live my life in a way that I can afford it. Well, how can I live my life in a way...

This is gonna sound a little bit also a little bit crazy, but we're talking here—why not? I think money is super fascinating, especially in this future that we live in because there's everyone in the universe is bound by money. But you really don't need like a hundred million dollars to find inner peace with yourself. Like, I have a moderately good-sized apartment in the East Village in Manhattan. I'm able to buy my meals going out. I'm not a multi-gazillionaire, but I'm also not scavenging for pennies and nickels here.

I've worked really hard for the past ten years, but I think it's important to take a look at what you want. How are you able to wake up every morning and say, "I'm gonna go work?" For me, it's for myself to be able to save money and just not go crazy about where's my next dollar because you're not under stress!

That many people, if they don't know where next month's rent is, that’s right! That puts tremendous stress on you physically, always being in uncertainty and not knowing, or being in so much debt that you might face personal bankruptcy, which changes your life forever!

That's right! And you know, it hurts you in many in the future!

I think this issue is an interesting one because you sound like you're a happy guy! You found a medium where you're not starving, and you're happy with what you've built for yourself, and you're able to pay for yourself.

That's right!

And so I think that's what everybody strives for! And so in regard to, you know, Michele's $30,000, he's making a decision about launching himself to get to where you are eventually!

Yeah! And he may start with that in the bank, or he may decide to invest it in college or in a master's degree or something like that, but I always tell people all the time, when you're looking at $30,000 you saved hard, and you're gonna invest in education—you better make it something you can get back!

That's right!

And so whatever makes you happy and actually something that you're good at, maybe you'll get them employed in it. Because not everybody's gonna be an entrepreneur!

But I love that question! And I just want to add one more thing also—like with patience! I mean this person, if they're still undergrad, you know, 19, 20, 21 years old, that $30,000 if they go pursue, you know, get a master's degree in engineering or something, they're looking at a hundred thousand dollar salary in their first year, possibly—a master's degree in engineering costs you 60 to 80 grand, including—

That's right!

It ain't! So patience, right? You take hit pause on your life, and then, you know, press play when you're 25, 26 after you've been working for four or five!

Makes the assumption you've decided this career path will get me a job, which is something you've gotta think about if you're gonna part with $30,000! That's all I say to people: think about it! I mean, just think about it!

I get the high school journey, but when you go in and you start paying for college, that's an investment in yourself—make it worth it! Like, going to college and just blowing your brains out partying is a real waste of dough if there's no outcome on the other end, which is the mistake I made when I went to college! My dad said, "You're gonna starve to death! You better go back and get a master's in business 'cause you are going to just have no income!"

And that's what you did!

Yeah! I was a shuffleboard expert! You know, and I went and did arts, and it's a long step—I made my money hustling shuffleboard against engineers who all got jobs, and I was still...

That's exactly what happened!

Here's one from Luke. What's the one thing that someone should—if they want to improve their appearance but don't have unlimited funds!

Interesting! What's the one—Luke is asking, what's the one thing someone should invest in to improve their appearance? So he's making an assumption about how important appearance is, but they don't have a lot of money. What do you think that is? Should we unpack this here for a second?

It's an interesting question! Is appearance a haircut? Is it your, you know, your apparel? Is it—?

I think intrinsic! And Luke's question is the idea that somehow your appearance, your image, your brand, your karma—what other people think about you when they first see you, which happens every day—people see you for the first time all over. That's scary!

It's true, though!

And so I think people should consider their brand, their image, the way they look, and they can decide to look different ways for different groups. But I'll give you an example: when I go to meet with money, when I'm in financial services talking about O-share, ETFs, eyewear, a crisp suit, a white shirt, a tie, shiny shoes—because that's what they expect to see! When I'm sitting here with you, here right now, having a great time, I'm selling my own merch, by the way! Time to promote this! When I'm here pitching my own merch—coldhardmerch.com—very exclusive shirt! I just love this piece, by the way!

I think we have a limited number, but you'll learn more about it later! But you know, I'm always selling! What can you say?

But my point is, I want to feel comfortable talking with you, and you're not wearing a suit, so why should I? And we understand each other on this thing.

So at the end of the day, what's your answer to Luke? What can you do? You may not have a lot of dough, but you want to change your image—what's the plan?

Tough question! It's really a tough question! I would say authenticity—like be comfortable with yourself! You know, you can look good in anything! You could also look bad in anything! If you get a weird haircut and you don't feel comfortable in it, it's going to sort of seep through, and people are gonna be able to sense that you're uncomfortable in your own skin!

I also think good sleep is vastly underrated! There's just like this, you know, I like...

I like that! Where's this notion of work, work, work? I mean, like, you work jobs through college! You know, staying up all night—like it makes money, but quality sleep is vastly underrated. So Luke, if you're not getting a good night's sleep, I think you should personally invest in a really good night's sleep, and it'll just make you sort of feel better overall!

And then just be comfortable in your own skin!

I'm gonna give you a little data that I learned a couple of weeks ago. I got hired to be a keynote speaker to a group of HR executives—human resources executives work for large corporations.

And when we were doing that, the breakout after the keynote, maybe I had 15 of them in a room—no press, no just open dialogue! And I asked them a question: because in these giant companies, they write policy books about appearance, about apparel, about protocol in HR! But I asked them because I had a discussion with my daughter earlier that day about tattoos and inking yourself, you know, because everybody's doing it these days!

So I said to them, "I'd like to get an answer—I'm not recording anything, I'm not taping anything! When a candidate comes in for a job, fantastic resume, and they have ink on their face, they've got a tattoo on their face, or their neck, or it's exposed in a way on their head, does that in any way change your perception of them for the job?"

Remember no, nobody's recording! There was a really long uncomfortable silence, but to a tee, every one of them said, "Yeah, that freaks me out! I worry about how the messaging is to our customers, to other employees; if they're uncomfortable, there's a red lightning bolt across their forehead or imagery up the side of their neck."

And so I'm telling people—and I'm not endorsing either way—but if you're gonna ink yourself in your face and you're going into and you want to pursue a path with a large company, and by the way a lot of these were tech HR guys with companies that you know that you want to get a job at, they're not cool with it!

What do you think about that?

Face tattoos exist in this really sort of like singular category! Like, it gives off like a—I don't know!

I also like, on the one hand, to give off a rebel without a cause vibe!

There's a "yes, I don't care what you think" vibe, yes!

I mean, nothing against people that tattoo themselves on their neck, on their hands, on their face, but it's just like, it sends a message, you know?

Is it a good message for your career? This is the question we're trying to answer here!

If they're qualified, it shouldn't matter!

It shouldn't matter!

Do you think it does?

I am NOT a hiring manager, Kevin, but I think if I were to ever do risk it—because there's always two candidates, there's always two resumes—there's always one. In our case, we're discussing here...

I would— I would because you could always fire them if they're not performing!

Interesting answers! So you support that rebel nature because maybe what matters is their ability to execute. Maybe they're a brilliant mind, but I think my answer is I think they're selected against in a way that's not fair, but it happens anyways!

So I just want the viewership to understand there's a risk to this—it's not free! And if you do it, you’re taking, at least for some people, you're telling them something they don't want to hear—that's what I'm saying!

I have no tattoos! If I were...

Either do I!

But I have nothing against them. I have no problem with it! We have lots of—my companies, everybody's got tattoos! I don't give a! But I'm trying to give advice to people that are trying to advance their careers in some amazing companies that I know they want to work at, and these HR guys were clear! They were clear!

So Luke, no face tats! Face tats—that’s the first thing!

Look, that’s good! Let's move on!

Alright, Michelle, what do you got for us?

Michelle! Hi Mr. Wonderful! What do you think of the hype around 5G? Do you think it'll revolutionize our homes, jobs, and the way we travel, or do you think it's largely just marketing hype?

Sam, honey sweetie, poopsie baby! 5G—that's right up your alley! What are you thinking on 5G—marketing hype or real benefit?

Both! Story time! When I was at Rutgers, I remember the iPhone 5 came out; Rutgers University is in New Brunswick, New Jersey, and it was the first city to light up 4G LTE! LTE is Long-Term Evolution. It kind of got bundled—like 4G was the fourth generation of wireless tech for smartphones, and then branding sort of blended like 4G LTE—it's the same thing!

Anybody even understand what the hell that means?

No, no! It just means about how fast can you scroll through Instagram without waiting for the video to buffer. Basically, for all that!

That's if you understand what that is, sure!

Sure! It's how fast are you basically pulling data from towers, which are getting data from satellites!

It’s... when I was at Rutgers, and I remember vividly, I would do speed tests on my iPhone 5 or 5s—whichever one had LTE first. I think it was the five. I was getting like 50 or 60 down, which is pretty good speeds even by today's standards! This is literally 2009, 2010—there's a lot less pressure on the network at that time!

That's exactly what I was going to get at! There was no one else that had an iPhone with LTE! Every guy and their dog is putting pressure on the network!

That is right!

So in the beginning days, LTE was fantastic! I remember just being obsessed with doing speed tests; I was getting sometimes over a hundred down, like, in a moving car! I was like, this is awesome! This is like faster than my Wi-Fi at home! This is ten years ago!

Now the networks are so congested that no matter where we are—in New York City, one of the most densely populated cities in the world—no matter what network you have, it is not great!

The promise of LTE and 4G didn't really, in my opinion, pan out to be some super extraordinary thing! There are times where my data is great, where I can, you know, browse TikTok and watch YouTube videos without buffering, and then there are also times where my data is like, "Yep, this is cellular service in 2020," and it's not great!

I think we are at a time right now where, Michelle, if you go spend the money on a 5G phone and you go on Verizon or you go on T-Mobile, there's like the OnePlus 7 Pro has a 5G version, I think!

But how far—what's the distribution of 5G right now?

Even major, major—let's talk Chicago, New York, Miami, LA, maybe Houston, maybe Dallas!

A little bit of technicality here; there are a few different things—it's basically—it’s all marketing right now!

For now!

Yes, for now! Of course companies are gonna race to say we have the first 5G Network! Verizon is doing the millimeter wave 5G!

So 5G— in order to roll out the infrastructure, there needs to be physical boxes! These literally gray boxes, no matter who you are— you can be Verizon, be ATT, you can be anybody else—you still need the 5G boxes.

There are these... and that... there are a density of the vicinity of those boxes!

Alright, I'll answer your question without spewing too much text!

Yeah, don’t make it so tough!

Shame on you!

Right now, 5G is, I would say, 75% marketing and 25% practical, where you need to be in a 5G city in order to take close to the transponder! Yes, Marques Brownlee, who was a guest on your show a couple of weeks ago, has two great videos on his channel about 5G. If you're interested in 5G, go watch his videos! He explains it—you need to have a direct line of sight, you need to be in a city where these boxes are!

I would say, Michelle, this is January of 2020! Let's talk again!

And I've literally... 2020 to let Apple put out... I think Apple might do a 5G phone this year! But the networks aren't ready yet!

I have a different take on this from a practical reason! I travel sometimes in a week to seven cities—the internet is everywhere! It really is!

And I carry two phones with me! Would you pass that blue one on the table there? The reason I carry two phones is these are live two phones—multiple accounts—is winter four networks, seven different networks; one is AT&T, one is Verizon, because in any city one of them doesn't work!

I know they like to say, "Oh, they're the best!" No, they're not! They don't work! You have to—if you're on the East Coast, you want Verizon. If you’re in the West Coast, AT&T in the hills of Hollywood—you've got garbage! Nothing works in the hills of Hollywood!

The point is between the two of them, they have a lot of work to do!

And I love both these companies! I don't want to bash them because I know how hard it is! But the internet in America should be like electricity! When you turn it on, it should work, and you should never be, you know, crapped out in it the way I am all over the place!

I think—and my hope is that 5G in the next five years will make it ubiquitous like electricity! So the devices and people can work together and have a consistency that we don't have now!

And I'm saying this on the record—the internet sucks! Mobile internet—it’s absolute!

I expect so much more! So for both Verizon, AT&T, and all the other players in here, you guys have a lot of work to do because Mr. Wonderful is very unhappy! And I'm not the only one! You know exactly what I'm talking about!

Let’s take another question here! I love that question! That was great!

Alright, John! Hit us!

Hey Mr. Wonderful! John from Kentucky! I just wanted to know your opinion on moonlighting a business if you have a full-time job and a family full of hungry mouths to feed. And say you’re in my position, and you’re the sole breadwinner of your family. I want to know your thoughts on any extra profit from your moonlight business! How should you use that? What would you do if you were in my shoes and you just started a moonlit business?

Thank you for your time! You have a good day!

Very interesting question! He's basically at a point in his life where he has to feed the kids, pay the rent, make sure the family is okay, and still he wants to be an entrepreneur!

What do you think? Money's got to come from somewhere!

You poo-pooed money earlier in the show, now you’re thinking how tough it is for this guy!

Well, I don't have a wife or kids!

That could happen!

It generally does, it generally does! If he’s in that position now, he didn’t say how old he is—it sounded to me like he was in his mid-thirties!

Okay, yeah! So he has a side hustle, as we'll call it right—that he wants to pursue, as that’s what he means by this moonlit business!

That's what it is! At night, he has no other time; he's got to work all day, National Tire Days, he works all day, has little—maybe some time with his kids—they go to bed, and then he goes to work again!

That's tough!

It's sort of the realities you have to take care of. Your family is always number one! You gotta make sure they're safe and fed and you're providing for them! And that is your role as that, in this case, you sound like the patriarch of the family! By the way, there are many cases where women have taken over—they're making more than men, and the way it should be is they become the matriarch of the family! I'm cool either way! I don't care!

But the point is, somebody has to take on the responsibility; often it's together! Family first! This side hustle, if it starts to work, you should take every dollar you make and retire your debt—get rid of your mortgage! That's a perfect way to set up for the point when you can actually jump ship!

Generally, jumping ship in a new business—I’m gonna give you a number; it’s three million in sales! Why is it three million? Because most businesses after tax make 10 or 11 percent! Some make more, but that’s the average after tax on all your costs! So you’re doing three million in sales—you’re kind of making 300 grand a year, and you gotta be paid for the risk you’re taking!

Now, maybe you could do it at a two million, but I like three! When your business is doing three on the side hustle, you jump ship, you quit your job—boom! You spend full-time!

But that’s after you got yourself out of debt!

Nobody says, “Oh, that sounds impossible!” Not true! If you really want to make it happen, you're gonna bust your ass like this guy is doing, working at night! But if you’ve got something that’s real and sales continue to grow, you can jump off somewhere—I’ll give you two million or three million!

But not with nothing in sales! Because you don’t know if the product—the product is proven yet!

I like that question! But I love entrepreneurs that are willing to work basically 25 hours a day!

The guy doesn’t need sleep!

Let’s hear from Valerie Guren Hauser!

Hey Mr. Wonderful! 3D printing is here, but so far it's only been used for proof of concepts and models! Do you think this technology is ever going to be used for mainstream manufacturing? And if so, what do you think that will mean for everyday consumers?

Let me set up something before he answers! It’s been a huge disappointment for investors! It’s been on the market for over a decade! HP went nowhere with it! So many companies have, you know, heralded the advancement of 3D printing! The technology is slow as hell! It's not user-friendly to work with! It hasn’t proven itself yet, other than modeling and doing prototypes! What’s going on with 3D printing?

I think there's a consumer avenue and then there's the sort of enterprise avenue for 3D printing!

Okay, make sure to take on both for me!

A consumer avenue of 3D printing is like backing a 3D printer on Kickstarter! Like the MakerBot was a huge, huge success on Kickstarter and they're still producing them to this day! I think it's a cool—I don't want to call it a toy, but it's like a cool gadget to have in the house, if you're growing up with, you know, young kids! Or if you're raising young kids, having a 3D printer in the home can—you know, sort of spark their imagination to create whatever you want!

That’s assuming they can connect with the CAD software to actually drive it, right?

Yes! But you gave it—give the kids some, you know, some benefit of the doubt here! Maybe teach them a thing or two!

Just saying!

I'm cool with it, but it's very rudimentary compared to what the potential of this technology is!

So I mentioned earlier on the show—we had video games in the house growing up and my parents kind of just like got us computers and all this tech! I was always around tech, and I think that, you know, that really helped spawn my love for technology from a very young age! And I think if a, you know, a household has a 3D printer in it, whether it’s like printing a little toy that they find on Thingiverse or they, you know—if something breaks, they can—you—

You like it as a—I’m not going to call it a toy, but as an implementation of creativity!

Yes! So you think it has merit for that?

So, yes! A family getting one has some kids, they explore it on their own! Cool, it’s a cool thing!

How many homes do you go to that have a 3D printer?

Same-same! It’s not to be a reason for that! It might be price, it must be complexity of use!

I think the barrier to entry seems high, right, in terms of price?

Well, in terms of how do you use it? How do you, you know, what extrusion are you using? How do you—where do you get the software from? There seems like a very hard thing to just like—you can’t just pick up a book! You can pick up a book and read it! You can’t just pick up a 3D printer and print!

You know, for investors, it’s been a bust! I mean it never drove Hewlett-Packard into the stratosphere the way some people thought! Epson, anybody! The pretty companies—it never really took off as a mainstream! You think about a color inkjet printer—everybody has one!

That’s right!

3D printer use cases are, I would say, maybe we haven't found the proper use cases for a 3D, where really... it was trying to solve a problem that didn’t really exist.

Yes! But then there's also the enterprise route, which there are a couple of companies that are—there's one company in particular, ICON, that is 3D printing cement homes.

So there's that aspect of it where—

I need to get one of those from my backyard!

There you go! So you could find use for it, right?

Is that such a vertical? And so expensive to make one that can actually build a wall with windows and holes for electricity?

So I read up on this recently—the ICON house apparently costs ten thousand dollars to build, and whether that's the cost of the machinery or just the cost of goods or whatever it is—there’s also another company that's doing aerospace; they want to 3D print rockets!

I don’t think that they’ve sent a rocket out or space yet. I will say, though, there’s one company called Gravity Industries—there’s a gentleman named Richard Browning who built himself a fully functional jet suit, and they 3D print with metal and a bunch of other materials. They 3D printed this sort of suit and the structure—it’s jet engines.

I’ll send you a link after this! I made a video about it—it’s incredibly advanced technology for what it does! Is what you're saying, yes!

But it is not a consumer-lit up product!

Yes, definitely not! And all that over the last decade just hasn’t come! It’s not a TV, it’s not a computer where every household has one!

That’s right!

3D printing, maybe—I have never felt the desire to go research 3D printers because I gotta have one because you have no use for one!

Yeah, exactly!

So I think, bottom line is, yeah, I don’t think it’s gonna go anywhere except for the verticals you talked about in extreme case! But it’s advanced technology for some industries that use it to become more productive, and that’s cool! I think it’s cool!

It’s not gonna be a big consumer product, perhaps! It’s just too complex to use!

Listen, it was a fantastic episode, Ask Mr. Wonderful, with a great guy Sam here! Knows tech! We had a terrific time!

And you know, it’s funny—the questions always come in on a more personal basis, but somehow technology always creeps in.

Sam, thank you so much!

Thank you, Kevin! Great to be here!

Great to have you! And you know, welcome to my office in New York!

Yeah, it’s a good one!

Take care, everybody! See you next week!