Talking Investing, Business and YouTube with @NateOBrien

[Music] Well, welcome back to the channel, everybody! We are continuing on with our big new money advent calendar. I've got a pretty awesome video coming today because I'm sitting down with the man, the myth, the legend, Mr. Nate O'Brien. How you going, mate?

"Hey, thanks for having me!"

Oh, it's alright, no worries! How's things over in the states?

"Um, well, it's a little hectic right now. I mean some states are open, some states are closed. It's kind of crazy. We just had Thanksgiving; Christmas is coming up, but yeah, it's pretty crazy over here."

Yeah, and how's things going post-election? Is everything starting to calm down now as well?

"It definitely is. I was actually worried that there was gonna be a lot more sort of turmoil with, you know, with the election if it was even closer. You know, I try to stay away from politics sometimes because people get pretty..."

"Yeah, pretty... uh, hard. Brian, what are your political views, please? Can you please..."

"No, I wouldn't put you on the spot like that. I absolutely love politics, and in my private life, I talk politics all the time. But it's just, you know, you gotta be careful with a business. When your personal brand is your business, you wanna just kind of be careful. And I probably eventually I'll venture into the political world, but for now, we'll just keep it kind of Nate O'Brien 2024. Here we go, start it now!"

Yeah, well, I mean, by the rate of growth on your YouTube channel, you probably have the whole of America subscribed to you in four years, so there you go!

"Not quite, but you know, it's quite funny. I actually think Austrialians are, in terms of who watches my videos, it's Americans and then it's England and then it is Canada and then it's Australia. So about four percent of Australians."

There you go, four percent represent! Go Australia! What about you, though? What's your breakdown on yours? I've always been curious.

"Sorry, what's my breakdown on what?"

"Sorry, for like how many Australians watch your videos versus Americans?"

"It's very strange for me, actually. It's like if I have a really good month on YouTube and my views are up substantially, it's all from America."

Wow! I mean, that just shows you market size and whatnot, right?

"Yeah! If I have like a normal month or even like a down month, then it'll be basically everyone from hometown here. So it's really interesting, and it does show you that if you can, on YouTube, tap into the U.S. viewership, then you can really snowball. Because like the best months that I have, like, it's just true: the best months that I have are ones where my view percentage is very much in the United States, like 70-30!"

Wow, that's far more than I have. Usually, mine, my U.S. viewership is about 40 percent, and then the rest is very diversified.

"It's all Europe!"

Yeah, there you go, Europe. Yeah, they're minimalists over there!

"Well, they've got no space! They're all crammed into little boxes. They're like, 'Man, I live in London, I've got a shoebox that I need to live in! How can I kick out all of my junk?' That is actually better, watch some of your videos."

It's funny that you say that because I do have a big portion of my videos that do kind of talk about minimalism or productivity, and that is heavily based in Europe. I don't know why, but it's... it's like the average minimalist viewer, and not to just like totally generalize, but if you break it down, it's probably like a 30-year-old woman from Europe is what seems to be the average minimalist. Which is just a weird demographic difference from like the traditional personal finance stuff that you and I talk about, which is usually like a 27-year-old American male.

"Yup, yeah, that's basically it."

Have you ever looked at your guys to girls breakdown?

"Oh yeah! So mine was, for a long time, it was probably maybe 85 percent male. Like when we both started our channels, like almost four years ago, right? I mean, we started so long ago, I feel like."

Yeah, it's been a while.

"Yeah, I know! And it's funny because I think we've known each other for this whole time. Like, when we both had 100 subscribers, we would like message each other and comment on each other's videos. So it's a long time ago!"

Yeah, and it's really come a long way. But the breakdown for me was like 85-15 male, and then every year it just moved more and more female and now it's 50-50 female versus 50-50.

"Yeah, wow, there you go! I'm right now, I'm at 90 percent male, 10 percent female."

But there you go! That's so interesting, man. You could spend hours just breaking down YouTube analytics. You could just go on and on and on.

"But I wanted to talk to you a little bit about how you got started. You know, not just with YouTube, obviously, everyone knows you from YouTube, but a lot of your content still is focused around, you know, money and personal finance, and I kind of want to give the viewers that are watching a bit of a sense of how it all kind of started for you and where you got your interest from and how that developed over time."

So where do you kind of say that you first got interested or what were the things that led to you getting interested in personal finance and business and whatnot?

"Yeah, well, so I really love numbers and marketing. And this is probably why I love marketing, but also finance as well, is just because it's so easy to relate it to life. Right? Versus maybe something that could be a little more difficult, like say rocket science, which I probably wouldn't be capable of anyway, but it is difficult to relate it to everyday life, to you and me. Right? If we were to sit around at a dinner table and try to talk about thermal dynamics or something, it would just be right."

Yeah, so personal finance was just always really... it kind of... I don't want to say that it came to me easily, but everybody has something that they're drawn towards. I mean, my brothers were just really great with athletics; some people are great with music. For me, it just happened to be I was drawn towards that sort of counting and money. Like, I remember in elementary school, my teachers would just give me, you know, like they try to give you busy work. They give you like a jar of beans and just like count all of these beans for no reason. But I would love it! I would love it!

"It was just very strange how everyone's brains are different and function differently. So that's how I got drawn into finance naturally. So I've gotten lucky with that."

Nice! And how do you get, how do you then go from someone that's drawn naturally to finance and, you know, business and whatnot, to actually getting started creating your own personal brand? Even back, I remember I think one of the first videos that I watched of yours, it might have been literally like four years ago, I think it was you talking about starting like a lawn mowing business.

"Oh yeah, or something like that! And I remember watching that and that was just like so inspiring because you were really, like, you could see that you were passionate about it. And if I remember correctly, I might be wrong, but you used to actually do that yourself, didn't you?"

"Oh yeah, totally! So tell me some of the stuff like, were you always the guy kind of selling trading cards or mowing lawns or going to trash and treasure and flipping bits and bobs? How did you kind of get yourself into business, I suppose, as an adult now?"

"I think the first business venture that I started was probably I would steal all... I would take all my sister's toys and then I would sell them back to her. And this actually, I actually don't think I'm the only person to do this, though. I gotta write this down, because I'm pretty sure I've heard other people have done this too when they were like five years old. It was just something where you're just like, hey, this is, you know, just shake them down for money. My sister is two years younger than me, so she was like three; she had like a couple quarters, and I just, I would take all her toys and then say, 'Hey, if you want them back, you just give me all your stupid coins that you don't want anyway!'"

"No, but so my grandfather actually has a landscaping business, still. And so, you know, he's always just kind of done taking his own route with that rather than kind of having like the traditional job, which there's nothing wrong with, you know, traditional jobs, of course."

"Yeah, but I just really liked the freedom that he had, which, you know, could be like any day of the week, and you'd say, 'Hey, I'm gonna take some time off today and I'm gonna go do something. I'm gonna go spend time with my family or go on a vacation somewhere.' So having that flexibility with having your own business was something that I saw from a really young age, and I said, 'I want this, and I need to figure out how to do this.' And so yeah, I just started with those little businesses with like the chicken farm when I was like 11 or 12, and then, you know, the meal worm farm, auction flipping. I mean, there's so many ways to make money, and you don't have to reinvent the wheel with them, you know?"

"Yeah, it can be a simple business. It doesn't have to be like some startup; you don't have to be creating the new Microsoft or the new Tesla. You can start a basic cash-flowing business, mowing lawns and make, you know, 500 a week and be able to pay your bills with that from just working on weekends!"

"Yeah, no, I totally agree with that there. You're totally right. You don't need to reinvent the wheel. You can do something that someone has done, like a business that's been around for, you know, decades and decades and has not changed at all, and you can still find your own unique way of getting by, whether it be a geographic location or something about your business that you put into it."

"Yeah, I totally agree with you! I wish more people would just try something!"

"And you can just almost turn some of them into like basically just ATMs that just print money for you. I mean, not literally, of course! Like, don't actually print money in your basement or something, but... why be careful? I don't want people to take my words wrong here. But yeah, like, if you set it up properly. One of my favorite books is called The E-Myth, if you read that one. But just on basically how to scale a business and delegate and be able to set up a business and then have it almost run itself. You know, you hire a couple employees, they go out and they work for you, and then you're sitting in your office making money for somebody else's work, right? So that's kind of the key there too."

"Yeah, I agree! No, good advice! And then, we're moving on. So you're doing these little bits and bobs, different businesses, and then boom, here comes Nate O'Brien! The YouTube channel begins! When do you know the date that you started your YouTube channel?"

"I started on the 2nd of February 2017."

"You know, I think we... I think I probably... you're a couple of months ahead! I was about one month ahead of you because if you look at when my channel was created, you can see it publicly. I think it was like December 29th, 2016, because it was my New Year's resolution! I said I'm going to start a YouTube channel for 2017."

"Geez, that's a flipping good New Year's resolution!"

"Yeah, you know, it's funny! Actually, right on my desk here, I have a paper of like my subscriber goals. Hold on, my subscriber goals! I don't know if you can see that, but they were like, I like wrote all of them down! Like what I want to do and then what I actually hit for the year. And oh my gosh! So I think at the end of my first month, I had 65 subscribers, and then, you know, by the end of the first full year, it's like 5,500 subscribers! And like every month, I would write down how far I've gotten on it."

"Yeah, that's good! And that's a good... do you keep updating that or you're just like, you know what, not anymore?"

"I mean, well, because once you get so... just being honest with everyone here, I feel like once you get to 100,000 subscribers, it's not really the subscribers that you want to chase after anymore!"

"Exactly! You're sort of fulfilled on that end, and then you have other passions to go for or just kind of focusing on really creating just content that you really love!"

"That's a politically correct way of saying monetized playbacks."

"No, no, no! I totally get you! But I know I feel that as well! I mean, I feel like especially with like a lot of people strive for that YouTube plaque, you know, the silver play button, and they hit that hundred thousand and they get that shiny play button, they're like 'Oh yes, you know, I've done it!' And then you're right! You kind of do start to think about subscribers less because I feel like you've got this really fantastic base of support, and then from there, you just really try and get creative and be yourself and, you know, try and just think up these crazy kind of video ideas that maybe, you know, that the viewers want to see!"

"Yeah, totally! Alright, let's move it along! So now, how many subscribers are you up to now?"

"800 and... 800 and something million?"

"No, 800 and... hold on! Like he doesn't know, no, it's... I think it's like 838,000. I mean, I knew it was like 830-ish, but... you know, I don't track it every day."

"And that's where you've gotten to after literally three or four years, which is just phenomenal! And I feel like a lot of people now, even now, like I feel like we've been talking YouTube for so long, but even now in 2020, people are still just getting switched on to the idea of 'maybe I should start a YouTube channel!' You know, I've got I know a guy that follows my channel that literally what we're talking about mowing lawns and his YouTube channel is just him mowing lawns, and he does really well! Some of his videos have just so many views! Like millions of views!"

Wow! So let's talk someone trying to get into YouTube. From someone that's been there, done that, and has found amazing success on the platform, what do you think are some key things to consider when you're just starting out? So things to get you up and going!

"So I will say that I really do think that there is a small amount of luck involved in all of this in terms of the timing of when you find a hole in the market or an opportunity, right? So right now, I have a couple of things in mind of what I can share with your viewers on like some opportunities. But for finance, for example, I believe that you and I got really lucky that we were some of the first ones to start making finance videos on YouTube because I'm sure you remember like a year before we started our channels, there were like, if you went on YouTube and you typed in like 'how to invest' or 'how to save money,' it just didn't exist! It was like a one-minute Investopedia video or something from like 2008, right? So it didn't exist! And I don't want to try to like take credit for this, but I think collectively, you know, probably you, myself, and 50 to 100 other finance YouTubers kind of like almost built the finance YouTube community that we have today, right?"

"Um, so getting lucky and like seeing an opportunity at a certain time, and this can happen at any point, if somebody's on YouTube and you look at a channel and you say, 'Okay, well here's a channel that has 500,000 views on a video and they only have 2,000 subscribers, this must be some type of opportunity here, because they don't have many subscribers, but they have a lot of views!' And so that's a dead giveaway. But also, okay, yeah, yep! But also just niching down, right? Just niching down and trying to find those ones! Like mowing lawns, right? Like if you made a channel about that, it's a very small sort of tight-knit community! But really at the end of the day, it's what you really are most passionate about! I feel like it has to be the topic of your channel, and I'm sure you'd agree with that, right? Like for us, it's so easy to talk about finance because we love it, right? But otherwise, it'd feel like a job! You know, if I had to talk about science and biology and mitochondria or something all day, I would not enjoy it! It would not be fun, and it would be a job!"

"So yeah, I think that's probably one of the first things that I'd say as well is to make sure that you enjoy it!"

"Yeah, I think another thing to realize, again, when just starting out on the platform is that you've got—before you even... a lot of people just think about the money, and before you even start earning money, you have to achieve so many goals! Like, you have to get a thousand subscribers and your four thousand hours of watch time! So I always just tell people, you know, try and follow what you really love because otherwise, you're just gonna stop! I mean, it'll feel like work, like what you're saying, but you won't get paid for it! So that would be like hugely unmotivating, demotivating, whatever the word is!"

"So no, I totally agree with you there!"

"Yeah, and I've always viewed money as a byproduct of anything that I do with my personal brand! I just don't like to follow the money, chase the money! I just think that if you focus on creating quality content and sort of pleasing the consumer or the viewer, then money will follow behind that! But also, it's not really like the top priority for me! It's like sure, it's nice to have more income and more money flowing in, but it's like I said, it's sort of just a byproduct! And I want to—I didn't want to go specifically into your like revenue or whatever, but you're someone that's always kind of just been, you know, I'm just here, I'm running my YouTube channel, and that's it! And it's just me, and I'm just talking to the camera!"

"What do you see? I remember watching a video not too long ago; you're talking about your plans for next year in terms of, you know, scaling up your income! So I was wondering, like, what are some of your plans around that? Because you've always been someone who has been against—well, not against, but you haven't gone down the path of, you know, teaching through courses, you know, putting your knowledge into a course that can be bought by someone!"

"So what's next for your personal brand and going forward?"

"Well, for my brand, it's going to be, luckily, we have quite a bit of YouTube ad revenue in the finance niche because of the amount of advertisers and banks and brokerage firms who want to run ads on our videos. So our ad rates are probably, I mean, on average, probably five to ten times higher than the average YouTube channel."

"Yeah, right? Definitely! So like my CPMs are, you know, um, 35, almost 40! And I'm sure yours are kind of along that line as well, right?"

"Yeah, about 35, yeah! And people—that blows people's minds when they hear that! Because it just sounds like... it sounds fake! It's like how are your ad rates so high?! But it's just because it's an auction! Like if someone wants to run ads before this video here, they're gonna bid against each other! You know, say like Robinhood and M1 Finance and Barclays and Cit Bank, they're all trying to run ads on your video because I know that the viewers are very specific to this content! So they're gonna pay a lot more for customer acquisition!"

"Yeah, so I've gotten very lucky with ad revenue. It does still make up a decent size of my income, but also I've gone the sponsor route now as well. I realized how much you can actually make from, you know, a sponsor on a YouTube channel or on Instagram. And I think that a lot of people say, you know, sponsorships, that's dirty! You know, you're such a sellout! But I totally—to those people, I would say it's totally the opposite! Especially with, you know, channels that you follow and you trust. I mean, those trustworthy people aren't going to accept sponsorships from companies that they don't like 100 percent get behind."

"Exactly! What's one that you're sponsored with?"

"One of mine is, for instance, Stake, which is a brokerage platform that lets Australians and New Zealanders and people over in Europe invest cheaply in the U.S. market. So it's just focused on the U.S. market but from people that are outside. And I totally like—I get behind them! That's a great mission, and it's brokerage-free. And that's something that's been really—like it's been a big problem in Australia is trying to access the U.S. market because literally, I was using a broker and our brokerage fee, international brokerage fee, was 50 U.S. dollars."

"Wow! Yeah, wow! Insane! But yeah, like what are some of the sponsors that you've worked with in the past? And talk to us about why you actually came to that decision of agreeing to be sponsored by them?"

"So the last one I did was Wealthfront, which I just released earlier this week. Yeah, which is basically a robo-advisor. The people behind that company are extremely intelligent! I mean, if you look them up, you'll see that most of them are very high up, like the guy who wrote A Random Walk Down Wall Street, if you've read that book."

"Oh yeah, he's—"

"I haven't but I know of it! I think he's the chief investment officer. I don't want to say the wrong things here. But yeah, there's some pretty big people behind that, and then the one before that I did was for the Google Pixel 4a phone that came out."

"Oh yeah! Yeah, yeah, yeah!"

"Yeah, so like, you never know who's gonna reach out to you as well! I mean, um, Morning Brew, I did a sponsor with them, Lastpass, Audible. But yeah, it's fun and it's a nice way to just kind of increase revenue a little bit without being intrusive on my followers. Because exactly, I do kind of take that approach of I just think that free information is really—there's just so much of it that I don't have any online courses because I just—I feel like there's so much out there that I don't want to sell something!"

"I don't know, it's definitely a rare approach because I think most people sell products."

"Well, yeah, I think it is rare! I definitely—I think that you definitely—well, you would obviously know that you definitely could. I don't see there being too much as long as you are providing good value for money and you're actually sharing, you know, your own valuable insights. And I don't see too much of a problem with it, but you're right! It's... it's getting such a bad rap, isn't it? It's just gotten such a bad name, I suppose, over the last few years!"

"That's actually why I started Profitful, which is my business, which is about, you know, courses about structured courses about investing, is because I was just looking at some of the stuff that you could get in terms of paid courses for investing and finance and whatnot. I was just like, 'Holy mole! Like, you're paying how much and you're getting what?!' It's like someone’s gotta try and right that wrong!"

"Anyway, so I really want to create a course on YouTube growth with just real in-depth looking at analytics, breaking down the data, and not just like a fluff BS course of like, you know, 'Start, turn on your camera, record the video!' like actually breaking down analytics behind my channels and a network of other channels. So we'll see! I might explore that! But I can't really get myself to sell like a personal finance course because I feel like it would almost be counterintuitive if it's like, 'Pay me a hundred dollars to let me teach you how to save money!' It's like, we just spent a hundred dollars, you know? So I don't know, there's so many other ways to monetize! And like I said earlier, I'm not really here to like make money, it's sort of just like something as like a positive externality that comes from all this."

"No, no, I agree! I think your approach is amazing! So, clearly, like, but just by your following and the people that have signed up for what you're talking about, then your approach is definitely working!"

"Hey, I wanted to talk about travel for a bit! You've been traveling much lately?"

"Well, it's pretty difficult to do that now, of course! Are you—like what are the rules? Can you travel state to state? Is it a state-by-state thing?"

"So the thing about the United States is that it's been a big mess in the U.S. right now because the states have a lot of power, which I think is good! But like the problem though is that every state kind of just sets their own thing. So you can travel to all states, but like there's mandates and they try to stop other... so for example, I live in Pennsylvania, and Pennsylvania just implemented like you have to have a COVID test before you enter Pennsylvania."

"Oh, okay!"

"And it has to be like a negative COVID test! But the problem is like they can't really enforce it because I don't know, it's... well, there's too many people! But it's also... it's just like it's America! So people just kind of... I don't know, it's like just like extreme freedom, like just kind of like... you know what I mean? Like people! Yeah, so it's sort of problematic in that way too. But it's... so yeah, it's been a big mess, but every state sets their own thing!"

"Are you missing it? You're missing—because I've been following your Instagram as well for a long time, and whenever your little icon pops up, you're like 'Alright, which mountain is Nate going to be on top of this time?!'"

"Yeah! I was out in Colorado for the summer, which was really, really nice! I had an apartment out there for the summer right, and I was out in the Rocky Mountains! So it's like, you know, fourteen thousand feet for the fourteen-year mountain that we were climbing, and a lot of snow! But it was very fun!"

"That's awesome! I mean, so what are your personal kind of motivations for travel? Is it something that you just do just for fun, just for the hell of it to experience things? Or is it something that you do like to escape, you know, escapism from grinding like nine to five, working real hard? Like what is it for you? Or are you just someone that just likes to get out there and travel?"

"Yeah, it's so hard to put words to it because it’s just kind of just living! I mean, that's sort of the side of me that's sort of a little bit more like free-spirited, sort of just go out and live life and see what happens! And you know, don't really plan, just spontaneously go somewhere and see where you end up, and just enjoy life! Just a simple thing!"

"And correct me if I'm wrong, you're someone that's perfectly comfortable just traveling literally by yourself, right?"

"Oh, I think it's more fun traveling alone!"

"Right, of course! It's great to be with friends and that can make a lot more fun, but I think traveling alone forces you to meet other people and interact with others, and it's just really incredible!"

"What are some of your, what have been some of your favorite places?"

"I'm such like a travel noob! Like it's always something like, 'Oh man, I want to get into travel!' and then, it's just like, 'Oh, but this, and this, and that, and this, and that!' You always end up making excuses! So I've been to New Zealand, Australia obviously, and New Caledonia."

"How about that?"

"Where's that?"

"Oh, it's a Pacific island. I'm pretty sure. French-speaking, actually. But between us, yeah!"

"I remember you were going to come to L.A., I think, for Finn, right?"

"Oh well, I want to get to America! I mean, I reckon it's probably top on my list of destinations that I want to go! I mean, it's got SpaceX, so I want to go watch a rocket launch. It's also got Disneyland, so there are a few Disneyland's around the place!"

"Disneyland's alright! You can't just say Disneyland's alright! You're crushing my hopes and dreams, man!"

"No, it's the, I'm a Star Wars nerd! So it's that new Star Wars land that they, I don't know what they, they released it or they built it a year or two ago. But yeah no, what's been your favorite place to travel?"

"So, you know, I haven't been to a ton of places, I mean, because I didn't start traveling until that YouTube started picking up and I started to have a little bit more disposable income."

"Right."

"So I didn't leave America until last year. It was 2019 was the first time I traveled outside of the U.S. I absolutely love Europe! I think Ireland is one of my favorites. It was like an underdog; you don't expect Ireland to be like this extremely, like... I don't know, you just picture rain and... and..."

"Yeah, no, it was, I think like Ireland and Scotland, they're quite very, they're quite scenic!"

"And it's, I think what really makes or breaks a place that you go to, it tends to be the people that you meet, right? And how nice they are to you because I've gone to countries and like as soon as you get off the plane, someone's just so mean to you and you're like, 'Alright, well screw this country, I'm going to the next one!' Like, it only takes one person! So, and maybe this is bad, but it only takes one person to decide if you love a country or hate a country!"

"But Ireland is great! I wish I had been to Australia! Japan is incredible! I mean, um, but there's so many places still I have to go to! Really, there's 190 some countries in the world!"

"Yeah, that's crazy! That's a lot!"

"Yeah, we definitely gotta get you down to Australia!"

"It'll happen! I know, it's supposed to happen! Roadblock, don't we?! Yeah, I was going to stop by in June!"

"I think that what we were talking about back then might still have the potential of happening! But next year, obviously, once COVID is done warping, I'll do that!"

"Yeah, dude, you should definitely come! I want to take you to an AFL game! Have you ever seen Australian football?"

"No! Is that... oh my God! I don't even want to dig myself into a hole and ask if that's like rugby! Or... I'm just kidding! All the Aussies will be like, 'Nate O'Brien thinks our game is rugby? Are you serious?!'"

"No! I don't know how to explain it! It is quite a unique sport! But typically, I think most Americans have the reaction that it's quite brutal because it's... essentially, well, if you think about NFL, it's just like that! But there's no protective clothing. It's just like... yeah, kind of like rugby! Except it's not two lines just banging into each other all the time. There's actually... I've definitely seen some highlights... I've definitely seen like highlight videos of Australian football."

"Yeah, we'll have to get you to a game! Hey, how are you looking for time? You want to finish up soon? I got a couple of questions sent in by the viewers. You want to rattle through a few?"

"Oh yeah, I have plenty of time!"

"Alright, no worries! I gotta figure out how to do this whole Instagram thing! I'm not as good like you on Instagram! Alright, let's go!"

"So thanks very much, everyone, for sending in your questions by the way! We've got a fair few! So, I think I'll just... a couple of them, there's a bit of crossover. So let's ask this one first: Nate O'Brien, how do you balance being frugal but also— or being minimalist but also living in the present and enjoying yourself?"

"I think it's all about understanding where every dollar goes. And when you do this, it eases up a lot of pressure! So it's still... I think it's totally good to be frugal, but the goal is not to just totally, you know, save every penny that you make and never spend anything because you want to enjoy the fruits of your labor, right?"

"Yeah, and I think there'd be nothing worse than dying with like two million dollars in the bank but you didn't spend any of it. I mean, what's the point in that, right? So it's nice to be frugal and save money when you need to, but I think it's 100 percent okay to budget and save for things. For example, I have a travel fund, and I talk about this a lot. I have a travel fund where I put a few percent of my income into like a separate account that I use for any type of travel, so I can still enjoy my money, but it's all budgeted, right? I've accounted for all of it!"

"Yeah, no, that's smart!"

"Knowing, yeah, I feel like knowing where your money goes is a big step—a big step into being... still being able to enjoy what you want to do and running yourself like a business, right?"

"Yeah! Like you want to make sure that you're profitable! So you want to understand your assets, your liabilities, how much money are you bringing in every month, how much are you spending every month, and then make sure that it's balanced so that you're on top every month. I think definitely that's a really good point! I think that people should definitely always look at their cash flow! And that's the number one, I think number one thing I say is when people like, 'Oh, I want to get into, you know, save more money or investing!' I'm just like, 'Do you even understand like your basic cash flow? Like where are your money's going out? Where's your money coming in? Is the money coming in active, passive, blah blah blah?' Because understanding, I think, is the first step into unlocking really a financial literacy, even just about understanding yourself, I guess your own financial position! And once you actually... I know it's boring, but once you understand that financial situation, then everything else can... kind of you can just kind of figure it out because it's just like, 'Oh, okay, maybe I shouldn't have this Uber Eats three times a week! Maybe I should save that, and then maybe I will go to, you know, Colorado or something!'"

"And I actually tell people to start budgeting and tracking all the expenses before you even start investing! Like investing should be step number two or three after you've taken a good account of your finances because otherwise you might not have any idea of how much money you can afford to invest, right? So make sure you take care of that first stuff like the budgeting!"

"Yeah, and then you can go to invest. That sounds like good advice! Speaking of advice, another question that we had was: would you ever want to become a financial advisor?"

"Oh, I don't think so! You know, so the problem that I kind of have with financial advisors, first of all, I have a lot of friends who are legally financial advisors—great! So I don't want to bash on that occupation because of course, like people do need financial advisors. But I think the just the traditional view of a financial advisor is definitely going to be something that sort of will kind of go away over time because right now, most advisors charge like one percent management fees to manage your portfolio, and then in a lot of cases, they just put it into index funds that you could be doing yourself!"

"So I don't really, I don't kind of like the traditional financial advisor route. But of course, like I said, I don't want to bash on anybody because I have a lot of friends who do it, and they are very much needed."

"But, um, definitely!"

"Yeah, I think if you're switched on to money then, like, if you're interested and you understand your own financial situation, you realize that actually, I don't really need a financial advisor! But, like you say, there's so many people that aren't switched on to that sort of stuff!"

"We're not interested, so it's like... yeah, definitely!"

"Or, or for example, I get a lot of professional athletes who message me like people in the NFL and like NBA and stuff! It's weird! I don’t know because they just like somehow stumble upon me and they say, 'Hey Nate, where should I invest? Like I have 10 million dollars, where should I invest it?' And I'm like, 'Oh my God, I can't tell you what to do! I'm just some kid!'"

"So I say, 'Hey, you should really consult with a financial advisor! But don't go for the traditional one that will take like one percent management fees! Go to a financial advisor who will take like a flat fee of like a thousand dollars or two thousand dollars, and then they'll just give you like their opinion!' So that's what I tell them to do—I say go to a legitimate financial advisor who just takes a flat fee!"

"Rather than that percentage of your portfolio, who's the most... this is interesting now! Who's the most famous or the person that you've been most surprised to see pop up in comments or the old DM or something like that?"

"Um, you know, I'm not entirely sure. It's usually, uh—no, I'm not sure if I can give you a good answer on that. I mean, it's just like NFL players, just generally. Yeah, it's like, it's not like LeBron James! It's always like, uh, you know, like an offensive lineman for the eagles or something."

"Or the best of the second team!"

"Yeah, but they've all... they've fringe players! Yeah, but it is scary sometimes when you get those messages, and they're like, 'Hey, I have like eight million dollars laying around!' And I'm like, 'I don't... why are you going to me for this? Like, please, like don't look at me!' [Laughter]"

"Alright, let's move on to this next one! When do you believe the amount of finance channels on YouTube will reach a saturation point? Do you reckon we're there?"

"I so, I think we are there, but you should still start a channel now! Because I view it like; if you look at finance blogs, which was the era before finance YouTube, because every like in five to ten years there's like a new generation of like how people consume their finance content. So at first it was like books back in the 1900s, right? And then starting in the late 90s and very much like the early-mid 2000s, it was finance blogs."

"Yeah, and that's been lasted for maybe 10-15 years! You could start a finance blog and really crush it! And finance YouTube has only been around for four years now. So it's definitely still time! As long as you can create, it's getting more difficult to get to the top, so you have to really—you have to really be a lot smarter with how you're creating the content and making sure that you're beating out the rest of the pack to stay on top or to get on top and that's..."

"Yeah, and that goes back to what we're talking—I can't remember if we were on air or off air when we said this—is just finding something that's unique, something that makes you different to the next person. Finding that base layer of what you're saying before of having the information—like, really solid platform of information! But then also bringing something to the video that, you know, makes people want to stick around, I guess!"

"Exactly! Like entertainment! And I always use Graham Stephan as an example for that of how he gives great information, but then he adds the entertainment on top of it where he cracks a lot of jokes, and he's just a very good speaker. And I think that's why he really wins with YouTube because he adds that layer on top of entertainment."

"Yeah, definitely! I would 100 percent agree! That would be the example that I'd go to as well! Yeah, it's just you end up watching his content; you're getting so much good information, but you're also smiling! It's like no one's around you but you've still got this smile on your face like, 'Why am I smiling? I'm watching a YouTube video!' But yeah, he's got that, got that impact!"

"Um, alright! Should we do maybe one or two more?"

"Sure!"

"Oh, here's something controversial: are you a Bitcoin bull?"

"Wow! That is a tough question because, you know, I could go either way on it! On one side, you know, it's easy to look at fiat currencies and the U.S. dollar and we're just printing tons of money. And, you know, basically everything's fine as long as we say it's fine until the day it's not fine! But... so there are definitely a lot of concerns about the U.S. dollar and the global economy as a whole. But I'm not quite sure if Bitcoin is the answer to that!"

"I do have a small percentage of my portfolio, a few percent in cryptocurrencies. I view it sort of as like a speculative investment. Same for precious metals and collectibles. I like to keep between cryptocurrencies, precious metals, and collectibles; I like to keep those about just a tad bit below 10% of my investment portfolio. Just sort of as like a nice little diversification. Bitcoin really has been on a tear this entire year, hasn't it? It's been crazy! Everyone's talking about it now because everyone stopped talking about it because it crashed almost nothing, and now everyone's talking about it again because it's obviously back charging up through the roof!"

"Yeah, and the only other problem that I have with it is that I think a lot of people who buy it now are buying it because they're—let me just backtrack a little bit here and make a statement, the other problem I have with Bitcoin is that you don't really use it, right? Like, do you buy stuff in Bitcoin? I mean, it's other than like if you're on the dark web or something or buying some illegal goods or something, which I don't do! But, but so the actual like uses of Bitcoin versus the speculative side of it, and that's why just going back to some basic investing principles is that to make sure that you're investing and not speculating or gambling, right? And sometimes it's really easy for us to say, 'Oh yeah, this is an investment! I'm just gonna dump a hundred thousand dollars into Bitcoin!' But is it an investment or are you gambling? And that's just something that I always have to stop myself and ask myself, 'What am I doing here?'"

"Yeah, no, I agree! The question I tend to ask to myself is just like, 'Do I understand what I'm buying and what it's worth?' Because investments, you should be able to understand what it's currently worth! And you ask yourself, do you know what it might be worth in the future? Can you reason your way to where you think it might go and actually why it will hit that specific number? And if you can do that, then you're probably looking at investment! If you can't do that, then you're probably speculating!"

"Yeah, um, here's a... here's another cue, man! My followers are so brutal to me sometimes! They're ruthless! 'Hi Nate, what do you think of Brandon's new hair? What's the contact for your barber? Asking for Brandon!' Oh my gosh, guys, come on!"

"Everyone's been hating on me for my hair at the moment because I used to have a side part and swish it over, and now I'm just trying to grow it out! But it's at the awkward stage! It's not long, but it's not short! So, wait, hold on! Just turn a little bit! Like, I just want to see! Like... yeah, here we go! It's looking pretty filthy at the moment, isn't it?"

"Sorry, I'm not laughing at you! I'm just... it's, uh... yeah, I'm gonna end this right now! You're going for like the... you almost have like the Donald Trump flow!"

"Oh, that's it! Shave my head! Shave my head! I'm sorry! I'm sorry! Right now, I'm getting scissors right now!"

"Nah, nah! I like it! I like it! It's good! No, my girlfriend says that I should grow my hair out and eventually get it to a man bun, but there's like this massive awkward stage in the middle of the hair's not short but it's not long! And what can you do, you know?"

"Yeah, what can you do? It happens! That's why I've never had the courage to go through that phase! I've tried growing it out and then I'm like, 'Oh, I should just cut it before people start making comments!' But... yeah, yeah, you gotta get the flow! Just get the hair like down to your shoulders!"

"Just... uh, exactly! Because then you can do whatever you want with it!"

"I don't know the surface! So, guys, stop hating on my hair! Christ's sake! Anyway, hey man, thanks very much for your time! That was awesome! What a chat, hey?"

"Yeah, thanks for having me! What am I going to call this video? This is going to be like something like bantering for an hour! I don't even know how..."

"Nate O'Brien bantering for an hour? No, it's been like 40 minutes! Bantering with Nate O'Brien! That'll be the toilet video! What you got on for the rest of the day?"

"It's let me see what time is it? 6:24 here! So I'm just gonna crank out a video maybe tonight, and I'm firing up my Nate O'Brien show, my second YouTube channel! I'm getting that flown for 2021 to just have two channels! You know, two's better than one!"

"So what's the idea with Nate O'Brien? Show is that more like informal kind of less produced content? Like what's that? What's the difference there?"

"It's going to be anything that I want to talk about! I mean, just today, I released a 30-minute sort of tutorial on how to grow a YouTube channel! I mean just no edits, just 30 minutes, me sitting down, just talking to a camera, just dumping information! And I'll try to get out one a week on that! And just whatever I feel like talking about! You know, maybe we'll talk about politics, maybe we'll talk about business, whatever people want to see! But I think it'll be fun! And it's just like a little fun side project!"

"Nice! And what video are you working on for your main channel at the moment, or is it top secret?"

"I don't quite know! I think it's probably gonna be something around like how to care less or like, you know, sort of like how I became confident! Sort of like that in that realm, you know?"

"Yeah, that'll be good! Yeah, well, I'll certainly be tuning in as will a lot of people, I'm sure! Hey man, thanks so much for your time! Really appreciate you coming on the channel! And obviously, all the best with all of your ventures going forward! And hopefully we can get you back on the channel at some time, maybe in a year's time or something in person, we'll do another category in person!"

"Yeah, in person! I'll get a... Whatever works! If I'm allowed to go to the States or you guys are allowed to come over! We'll figure it out, yeah, because... yeah, it'd be mad to hang out! We'll go on a holiday! We'll go on a working holiday! I'll meet you in Dubai! How about Dubai?"

"Dubai? I'm there! Sold! Just like that!"

"Alright, cool! Hey, thanks very much for your time! It was great chatting to you, Nate!"

"Yeah, great talking! Thanks!"

[Music]

"Um... [Music] foreign."