Leadership and the Trucker Convoy | Tamara Lich and Tammy Peterson | EP 369

We were accused of taking money from foreign entities, which it's now come out that the Trudeau Foundation has been taking money from the Chinese government. And then we were accused of being infiltrated by the Russians, like foreign interference. Well, I mean, look at the situation that we're in right now.

[Music]

Hello everyone watching and listening! I am co-hosting this podcast today with my wife, Tammy Peterson. We had Tamara Leach, our guest, over for dinner last night. That went very well. We thought it would be useful to have both of us talk to her today.

Tamara Leach explains her role in the yellow vest-like rallies that occurred in Canada, the trucker convoy, her role in Wexit, a western Canadian independence party, and as I said recently, her leadership in the internationally recognized trucker Freedom Convoy. We discussed the current state of Canada, the current dismal state under Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, the tyranny he unleashed during the COVID pandemic, why so many patriotic Canadians are fed up, and the unprecedented punishment that's been unleashed upon those who, like Tamara, were daring enough to criticize their own leaders.

Yeah, oh Canada indeed. Looking forward to talking to her tomorrow. Maybe we'll start; maybe you can let people know a little bit about you. You said last night that you're from Saskatchewan. You should probably explain what the hell Saskatchewan is to everybody listening to begin with. And then you moved to Alberta. Why don't you just walk through where you came from? You worked in the oil and gas field too, which is relevant.

So yes, you want to fill people in?

I was born and raised in Saskatchewan, and I lived in Saskatchewan until about 1998. Then we moved to Medicine Hat because of the Alberta Advantage. At that time, we had really low energy prices there, and a lot of Saskatchewan people ended up in Alberta. Predominantly, I worked in the energy sector there in logistics and organization and administration, which is basically how I got involved in this because that was my skill set. So, I offered my services.

So what exactly were you doing? You worked in logistics administration, so what were you doing in the oil patch? You said also you were mostly working with men. What skill set did you develop?

I discovered I was really good at organizing. I looked after frac crews, I organized the frac crews, and our fracturing jobs. So I was responsible for finding the equipment, organizing the chemicals, the sand. I dealt with the salespeople in Calgary, and of course, our managers and stuff. And I discovered that I was really good at putting all these pieces together and helping patriarchy destroy the planet.

Yes, that's right. And really, really, you know, tight deadlines and such. I reveled in it. I was really good at it. So growing up and not really knowing what my place was, of course, trying to find your spot in the world, when I started doing that, I just found it so fulfilling, and I really loved it.

And what did you like about it?

The challenge. Yeah, it was a challenge. At that time, you know, we didn't always have—we were just a small base in Medicine Hat. So, we had to always find equipment from our larger bases in Red Deer and Grand Prairie and stuff like that. So, it was just fun. It was like putting the pieces of a puzzle together, but it had to be done.

And then, of course, dealing with a lot of—well, even at that time, we're talking the late '90s and the early 2000s—there was still a lot of consultants in the oil patch that didn't like dealing with women. So that was also quite fun. But yeah, it was something I discovered I was really good at, and I enjoyed it.

When did you start taking an interest in political matters and why?

That actually started with my former husband. So when I met him, he always had his nose in a newspaper. At that time, I mean, I was in my early 20s; I wasn't really interested in politics for sure. Then I started reading the newspaper. The National Post was the one that we subscribed to, and I started really loosely following reporters like Don Martin, Christie Blatchford, of course Rex Murphy, and I just started really paying attention to what was going on.

And it was when the sponsorship scandal hit that I thought, "What is going on here?" Like, there was no accountability; they were just spending taxpayers' money. Then I started, you know, checking into question period, and that baffled me also because I thought, you know, these people are just—it's theatrics. It's like watching a soap opera.

For me, I would rather turn on question period and see two sides of the house sitting at a table working together to try and fix our problems than just this soap opera theatrics that I was witnessing. And so that's kind of what led into my interest in politics, and that would have been in the late '90s, early 2000s. Yeah, so it's about 20 years ago.

So I really just kind of started following it around then, and I just couldn't understand why none of these politicians were being held accountable for their actions. That was already 20 years ago, and it’s gotten much, much worse.

Back when they were accountable, yeah, that's right, when they were supposed to be. I mean, I remember, you know, somebody losing their job over a 12-glass of orange juice. And now we have a Prime Minister that can just do whatever he wants, and there’s no account—like, there used to be some integrity.

It’s this interesting trick where if you have one scandal, the way you deal with it is just to produce another and overlay it on top of the previous scandal. He seems to be able to confuse people constantly with a never-ending string of increasingly dire scandals.

Yes, um, well, I don't understand it, that's for sure. But here we are now. You said when we were talking last night you said too that you also started to detect—and I don’t know when this was—a certain amount of desperation on the political front in the oil patch because of increasingly draconian federal policies.

So in Canada, for those of you who are watching and listening, the provinces in the west of Canada are pretty heavily resource-based, and Canada’s a resource-based economy still in many ways. Our federal government seems to have adopted a globalist agenda; I think that's fair to say. They believe that, you know, human beings, especially those in western Canada, are doing nothing but raping poor Mother Earth constantly.

And so they produce legislation in a never-ending string to do nothing but devastate the economies of the west, and of course, well they’re saving the planet—and Tamara started to see some of that or not saving the planet—which is really the truth—and Tamara started to see the manifestations of that directly in the people that you were working with. So you want to explain that a little bit?

Yes, I did. So they brought in the legislation, and I want to say it was around 2018-19 they passed the Bills C-69 and C-48. So Bill C-69 has been nicknamed the "No More Pipelines" Bill, and basically what they've done is they’ve made it virtually impossible and definitely not feasible for anyone to lay a pipeline with all their environmental this and that.

And of course, now then they added the gender thing; it had to fit into their whatever it was nonsense. And of course, Bill C-48, which was the "No More Tankers," well, basically it was a ban on Alberta oil tankers leaving the BC coast. Right. All the other tankers, ferries, cruise ships are okay—just not if it's carrying any oil from Alberta.

And what that did was it hurt a lot of families. People that I knew and that I cared about were losing their jobs and couldn’t find jobs. The situation I specifically referred to last night, because I’ll never forget it, was a grown man—and this happened frequently, but he's the one that broke down—coming into my office two weeks before Christmas because he just lost his job and begging me for a job with tears in his eyes. You know, "Please take my resume."

It was heartbreaking and devastating. And for what? I mean, I worked in that industry; I understand the process. I mean, Canadian energy is the most environmentally friendly and efficient way to extract our resources than anywhere on the planet, and we should be screaming that from the rooftops. But again, you know, we’re made to feel ashamed and like our oil is dirty, and I was dumbfounded.

Well, the question is "dirty" compared to what? Dirty compared to Middle Eastern tyrant oil or dirty compared to Russian oil, for example? In oil and gas, it’s like—and the same thing applies on the pipeline front and the tanker front too. So Alberta still moves its oil and gas around—oil in particular—but does that on rail cars, which is a very inefficient way of doing it. It’s also very dangerous because it passes through cities, and we've had the odd catastrophe in Canada as a consequence of that.

And so yeah, and what the Trudeau government has done is make pipeline developments so prohibitively expensive that no corporation in its right mind would take a risk on it. And I don't know how long that'll propagate out into the future because the corporations have learned that the Canadian government is an unreliable partner.

These are long-term projects, and so that’s a catastrophe, and this is a big deal for the rest of the world. You know, the German Chancellor came to Canada last year, and so did the Japanese Prime Minister, basically cap in hand. The German Chancellor was a socialist, by the way, which is sort of relevant in this context, desperate enough nonetheless to come and talk to his socialist buddy Trudeau and really ask and really beg, in some ways, for Canada to open up its vast natural gas resources to the European Union and our great allies, you know, and our partners in freedom, let’s say.

And Trudeau said, "I can't make a business case for that," which basically meant we've produced legislation in Canada that's crippled our industry so badly that no one could possibly make a business case for anything because of the red tape and idiocy that was put in there purposely, although also ineptly, just so the feds could virtue signal about destroying the economy to save the planet.

And then the Japanese Prime Minister showed up a couple of months later and asked for the same thing and got exactly the same response. And so instead of Canada benefiting from the billions of dollars that the Europeans and the Japanese could spend while we were supporting our allies, Japan, who’s threatened by China, and obviously the European Union, who’s threatened by Russia, we left them to the tender mercies of our apparent enemies because Canada is opposed to what Russia is doing in Ukraine, for example.

And we forfeited that immense economic benefit that Canadians could have accrued. It could hardly be stupider. And so you were seeing this play out in real time in Alberta.

Yes, I was. And at that time, I started joining—I found a local group in town that was doing rallies every weekend, and so I joined that group myself. I started going to these rallies, and we would basically stand outside of a Tim Hortons and hold signs and wave at people as they drove by. And then I became a bit of an organizer for those, too. So I set up their social media, which would later come into play in a bigger context, and organizing these rallies.

And we did that for quite a while, and but nothing was changing.

What was the group?

Well, we actually started off mimicking the yellow vest movement in France, which was really my first experience dealing with the mainstream media calling us a bunch of racists and white supremacists and this and that.

And the white supremacy— that’s a big thing in Alberta. I mean, I know I lived there, and they’re just white supremacists.

I know, it’s terrible.

It's absolutely terrible. Bingo balls in their windows, yeah. Yes, and they’re white supremacists.

Yes, and so I became active in that way. And through that process, I met Peter Downing, who at that point was starting the Wexit movement, which was a play on the whole Brexit UK movement. And then in 2019, when Trudeau won that election, I contacted Peter, and I said, "I’m yours. I will organize events or whatever you need in Southeastern Alberta."

And that was Peter Downing's name; he had started a big billboard campaign in Edmonton about these bills that they were passing. Well, because Alberta is largely an energy resource-dependent province, when you start crippling that, I mean, you’re not just talking about the guys that are drilling wells; you’re talking about all the service industries or the communities that depended on all those toxic masculine males coming into their city or into their communities to spend their money.

Well, people don’t know this too—Alberta is a landlocked province. So, it’s hard for Alberta to get its resources out into the world unless the rest of Canada cooperates. And on the west, Alberta is bordered by British Columbia, and the British Columbians often like to style themselves environmental socialists.

And so they like to block Alberta oil, and that’s a big problem. And then, but also rather perversely because of the way Canada is set up, the provinces to equalize economic opportunities across Canada hypothetically, we have this system called equalization payments, and that means the richer areas of the country essentially send excess tax money to poorer areas.

And so, as a consequence, Alberta, which has a very small population—about 2 million people—has heavily subsidized Quebec for decades, billions and billions of dollars. And the Quebec government in particular, although many of the Quebecois themselves also style themselves as saviors of the planet, are opposed to Alberta energy and its development, despite the fact that their economy is dependent in no small part on these transfer payments.

So they get to have all the money and also the moral virtue, which is a hell of a hard deal.

All the coastline heading over to—yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that's right. So they're rich in that way.

Yeah, they have coastline.

Yeah, well, they also—Quebec also has no shortage of natural gas itself, although they put a moratorium on its development. There’s enough natural gas in Quebec to service Quebec, which by the way imports natural gas from the United States to service Quebec for 200 years and the European Union for 50 years.

And the Quebec government has put a moratorium on its development for reasons completely unknown, crippling people who bought land in Quebec with the intent purpose of developing the natural gas resources there when the government told them that that's what they wanted to do.

And so, and that’s a story that hasn’t broken in the Canadian legacy media because the people who had their property essentially confiscated—it’s like one of the biggest scandals I’ve ever heard of in Canadian history, and no one knows about it. They had their property confiscated; can't even get the legacy media interested enough to do a story on it.

It's just beyond comprehension.

So we have a very adult country at the moment. All right, so you started getting involved politically with Wexit, for example, and working on the idea that Alberta and the West at least had to put pressure on central Canada, letting them know that we’re dead serious about not having the federal government for the second time demolish Alberta's economy.

Because, for all of you who are watching and listening, when Justin Trudeau's father was prime minister back in the 1980s, he rammed through a policy called the national energy policy, which devastated the Alberta economy for about 15 years.

Broke our banks.

Yeah, broke our banks.

My parents lost their pension funds, and the whole teachers’ union lost his pension funds. I think 13 Canadian banks went bankrupt at that time, which was the first time in Canadian history that anything like that happened.

Anyone who’d saved money, they left—they lost it.

Yeah, yeah, so the West has been screwed by Trudeaus before, and now we’re living through that again. And so there is agitation in the West to put pressure on the central government, and some of that pressure involves the threat of potential secession, although I think that's very unlikely.

I know that Danielle Smith in Alberta and Scott Moe in Saskatchewan and the premier of Manitoba have now put together a consortium to try to develop a port in James Bay, which is, you know, pretty damn awkward because you have to go through the Arctic ice in a desperate bid to try to get Western resources out to the rest of the world.

So we’re basically at economic war in our own damn country, you know, while we fiddle around not saving the planet instead of cooperating together to make everybody in Canada as rich as Norwegians, which is exactly what we should be aiming at and could have done decades ago if we weren't so damn stupid—so stupid blind.

What would you say?

Moral, falsely moral virtue signaling.

Right.

Yeah, pretty damn pathetic.

Yes, and so all right, so you were working with Wexit, and that was in 2000—and that was after the 2019 election. And so I joined the board of directors for two. We had Wexit Alberta, so what happened was there was Wexit BC, Wexit Alberta, Wexit Saskatchewan, and Wexit Manitoba, and those were the provincial arms, and then Wexit Canada, which we turned into the Maverick party, which was a federal western independence party so that we could start fighting for more rights—right from and for more control over the West.

Yeah, more to be just left the hell alone.

Yes, in Canada, people need to know this too, resource development is a provincial matter, not a federal matter. The federal government actually has no constitutional right to be interfering in this regard whatsoever, and so it's a real encroachment on—because Canada was set up as a true subsidiary organization, with each level of government having its requisite responsibility, and the responsibility of the federal government was actually quite limited.

It didn’t extend to resource development and so there is no excuse for the feds to continually encroach on resource development territory.

You know, there’s another aspect of Canada that people might find interesting, in so far as Canada is the least bit interesting, and that is that the West in Canada was only settled about 120 years ago, and it's always suffered from, I suppose, what would you say, a quasi-colonial relationship with the powers that be in Eastern Canada.

And there are no shortage of Eastern Canadians who still think of the country that way, that everybody in the West is a bunch of rednecks, which is probably true, but you know, rednecks have their advantages and that they should really be told how to live properly by those who know better.

And it's certainly the case that there’s a cadre of Eastern Canadians, and there has been for a long time, who truly do believe, like the bloody WEF, that they know how to live better and are perfectly willing to impose that viewpoint on the rest of the country and the world.

So you’re part of the battle against that, and that’s been going on fairly intently in Western Canada for a long period of time. It’s thrown up all sorts of rebellious political parties over the last hundred-year period, some successful and some not.

Yes, all right, so you cut your teeth on the political front with the Wexit movement. What did you learn from that?

I learned a ton from that. I learned, of course, being on that board, what we created—a federal party from nothing. So I learned about, you know, creating the EDAs and the importance of having committees and delegating and being organized.

I mean, that was a massive yes.

Of Jeff, yeah. Electoral districts.

Yeah, writings, basically setting up candidates and writings and stuff like that. And I met a lot of really good people. I mean, there are so many great people in Western Canada that are very concerned about what’s happening to them, you know? So that was a massive experience for me, and I got to work with Jay Hill, who was a whip for the Conservative Party four times, and he was our leader, and I learned a lot from both him and his wife also.

I mean, we just had an amazing team, and again, that would come in handy later.

Right, so you’re expanding your logistics abilities.

Yes, doing this.

And yeah, so it’s interesting. You know, you did what people should do in their life as far as I’m concerned, which is you established a local base of competence, so well partly within your family and then within the industry you were working at, you learned how to organize.

And then you noticed that maybe you had a political responsibility, which everyone does because otherwise the tyrants have it, and that’s bloody well worth knowing.

Yeah, and so you decided to step forward into the political realm and started. Well, you learn by doing.

Yes, and you started working. You know, it’s uh, it’s you’re tilting at windmills fundamentally if you’re trying to produce a western separatist party because that’s the probability that’s going to fly is pretty low, which doesn’t mean it isn’t necessary, right?

But you learn a lot as you go along, being a fool and stumbling forward. So you’re doing that and expanding your logistics capability as well.

Yes, in a different realm.

And that was one of the first speeches I was asked to give—a speech at one of the first rallies that I attended back when we were doing the yellow vest rallies. And I didn’t really know what I was going to speak about. I’m not an orator; I’m not a public speaker.

But what struck me the most was—I thought like I’m sorry, like I thought somebody else was going to come and fix the problem. So I didn’t worry about it. I thought a politician, a businessman, somebody with some level of, you know, clout would step up and solve the problem and say something, and it wasn’t happening.

And it wasn’t happening. So the first speech that I gave was like that, and I ended it—it was like I am somebody else, and you were somebody else, and you were somebody else. We can’t sit around here and wait for another person; it’s up to me too.

It’s up, yes, exactly. You’re doing your part, and we’re listening to your story. People gotta listen and know they have it in them.

Well, what have you learned on that front?

I mean, you were very skeptical about any sort of political organization.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah! So, but I gave up. Young, I thought, oh, you know, I don’t need to be a part of this.

Something happened when I was young—like a political sword when I was like 17. Local politics made me jaded, and I thought, "Okay, why don't you tell that story a little bit?"

Oh, I was a supervisor for a swimming pool in our little town in Northern Alberta, and it had been built in '67 because they built pools all over Canada in '67.

And it was a bit deep, so when the kids came from school, they were six and weren’t quite tall enough to be in that water. I’d roped it off, so there were three sections, but when the kids got in, I could see, even though there were teachers in the water, I’d say, “That one’s underwater, pull that one out! That one’s underwater, pull that one out!”

So after it was over, I said to the bored, the city, the town board, I’m going to ask for a parent to come in for every 10 kids from now on because it’s not safe, and I can’t—

Well, we don’t want to do this! So the next week, the school showed up, and they had no extra people, so I didn’t let them in.

So then the Town Council called me, and they told me that I had made the mistake. And I said, well, you know, I think that a mistake might have made it, but the mistake that was going to be made was there was going to be a death of a little kid, and I could do that.

And they said, I said, "You can write me a letter and tell me how you want me to run this place—I'll run it the way you want it—but I want you to sign that letter!"

And they said, "If we do that, you’d let a kid die despite us!"

Yeah, that’s what they said. That was 17, and I was like, you know, and I could have taken their bluff, but I was a 17-year-old girl. I didn’t have that kind of—

Quit!

Which spurred—I didn’t have the knowledge.

So I quit the job, and then there was a local paper controversy between the mayor and their draw, their story and my story, and then I left. And the local college hired me to pick weeds, and that was good at the local college.

Yeah, well, what Tam learned, I learned I did one part of it. You know, she saw a certain degree of narcissism and corruption at the local level and then concluded that that was the case at all levels of the political, which is true.

Yeah, but that’s still not an excuse; that’s not to do your part, and I learned that over the years.

Yeah, and so when did you learn that?

Not that long ago!

Yeah, yeah, not that long ago, but I know that now, and that’s all you can do, is know it now and move forward.

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Yeah, well, one of the rules that I’ve been formulating as we tour is that any political responsibility you abdicate will be taken up by tyrants and used against you.

Yeah, and everyone has a political responsibility, right?

So, well, you obviously learned that.

All right, so now you’re working with the Wexit party, and you’re expanding your logistical knowledge. What happens next?

COVID, right away!

Yeah, so during my time in Alberta about 2013, I took a personal training course when I started working in fitness, and then I actually started teaching and certifying personal trainers, then teaching CPR and nutrition.

And so, that was one of the very first things when this all started. I was like, "What is going on here?" because they started closing all the gyms, and like, I’m not a doctor or a scientist, but I know that if you're healthy and you’re exercising, your immune system is going to be stronger.

And then right away it came out that one of the comorbidities that was causing, you know, those terrible reactions to the COVID virus was obesity. I think the people who died had a mean number of comorbidities was four, right?

And in Alberta, the average age of death due to COVID, they said, was 84, but in Alberta, the average age of death from anything, old age, is 82. So then I couldn’t understand why they were locking us all in our homes and telling me that my family wasn’t allowed in my home.

Yeah, that did not work for me. That did not work for me.

So my husband and I ended up, after we both lost our jobs on the same day, we decided to drive out to Manitoba to visit my daughters.

Okay, why’d you lose your jobs?

We were laid off. We were laid off because we’d been sent home already. Well, I’d been sent home for two weeks because of COVID, and then of course there was the economic impact that came down with that. We were a satellite base, basically in Medicine Hat, so we ran two crews out of there as opposed to Red Deer, where they had five or six crews or whatever. So they ended up shutting down our base and laying everybody off, save a couple of gentlemen that were transferred.

And we decided to drive out to Manitoba to visit one of my daughters who was out there on the farm because our choices were we can sit here in our house and do nothing and watch the cars go by, or we can go be productive and have a life and, you know, be outside and doing stuff.

So when we arrived there, I found out that I was going to be a grandmother again. So we drove back to Medicine Hat, packed up a bunch of stuff and we spent 19 months during the pandemic out in Manitoba.

Nice!

And I ended up getting a job there with the local municipality, which was good. That summer, I got a job there, and that’s why I called it the pandemic of the Karens because I had, especially at Christmas, this one lady called me just freaking out and angry because there were four cars parked across the street at the Airbnb. I think it’s an illegal gathering.

Oh yeah, she has the same voice I do for parents.

Yeah, there are four cars across the street, yeah, and I think they’re having an illegal gathering and we should really do something about that because there are children at risk.

That’s right!

Yeah, Pat, Pat, Pat!

I know, and I’m just thinking, I did my job. I took all our information, I passed it on to my CAO, and I thought it’s Christmas. Like, this family probably hasn’t even got to see each other in the last year. You don’t have to go over there. You don’t have to go on their property. You can just stay in your home and shut your mouth and your windows and your curtains and quit peering out like, I just didn’t—I just don’t understand that mentality.

I didn’t understand it, and they weaponized. They weaponized people doing the right thing. They weaponized duty and yeah, they used fear to weaponize duty.

Yes, yeah. Well, that’s typical tyrant. That’s a typical tyrant approach.

Yeah, no, they take that fear, compulsion power.

You have to do this.

Why do you have to do it? Well, it’s an emergency.

Who says it’s an emergency?

We say it’s an emergency. We know what to do about it. Give up all your autonomy; grant us all the power. It’s like, “Oh, I see! That’s why there’s an emergency, so you can have all the power. It’s not an emergency at all!”

That’s right!

And if it is, it’s like, well, was it an emergency? There’s always a bloody emergency of one form or another because life is just an endless catastrophe of emergencies.

If you remember at the beginning of the pandemic, Justin Trudeau already wanted to invoke the Emergencies Act so that he could just spend, spend, spend, spend, spend, and do whatever he wanted and not be accountable.

I remember he wanted free reign until the end of 2021. Well, he basically suspended Parliament anyway and ruled by fiat the whole time.

Yes, Parliament in Canada has just become, it's like a sideshow. That's not where the government actually operates; it operates out of the Prime Minister's office—with him and his bloody cronies, his wedding party crew, you know? And so we’ve lost—well, I don’t know if we have parliamentary supremacy in Canada at all now.

And of course, the way that we’ve rearranged our judiciary, we have activist judiciary in Canada, and increasingly the Supreme Court Justices are nominated by the federal government, and so they’ve captured the court system as well.

And so, well, and so here we are. All right, so now you have a B and your bonnet about COVID too, and you’re not very happy about what’s happening in Western Canada. So you’re starting to become an irritated person.

I was very irritated, and then I found Trish Wood’s podcast. I was following the Dr. Brian Bridal case and then the Dr. Francis Christian case.

And what were those cases?

Dr. Brian Bridle is an immunologist and a virologist, I believe, and he's got a long list of letters after his name, and he started material University—?

Guelph!

Guelph—yes, that’s right, and Dr. Christian was a doctor in Saskatchewan—from the University of Saskatchewan actually, and he started speaking out about vaccinating children. Well, they both were, and they both lost their jobs.

And as a matter of fact, the faculty at the University of Saskatoon were trying to talk to him like maybe he was crazy.

Yeah, yeah, that phone call was disturbing.

Well, there’s no cowards like faculty cowards, right?

Yeah, you probably know.

And so then I started following her podcast, and she was just a light in the dark because I was somebody that was finally talking common sense in my opinion.

Then I started following Dr. Zev Zelenko. I started following Dr. Robert Malone, Dr. Peter McCullough, Dr. David Martin, you know, all these doctors.

Front too, they really went after him. He lost 35 pounds in three months after he got pilloried by his peers and compatriots at Stanford for being correct and careful.

Yeah, and that also didn’t make sense because science is supposed to be questioned. So when I—they say we’re following the science, I always think of the S with the money sign S. That’s all I ever heard them say was we’re following the science.

I never saw any of their science. I did see science from these other doctors.

And science, by the way, isn’t something you follow. Science is not a set of moral prescriptions. When it’s a set of moral prescriptions, it’s ideology, not science. You know, at its best, science attempts to be a value-free and dispassionate portrayal of the facts. Now that's tricky because it’s an investigation.

Yeah, it’s an investigation.

Yeah! And the idea that—and then what happened too is the politicians who were cowards devolved their authority to public health experts.

Well, we don’t actually have to make any decisions; the public health experts can, and they couldn’t because they weren’t economists. They had no idea how to calculate relative risk. They didn’t take anything into account except keeping the public safe from a virus, which was their job, not to calculate the—what would you call it—the multiplicity of costs that would be associated with a peer public health approach to policy.

So the politicians abdicated their responsibility, and the narcissistic politicians enjoy doing that anyway because what you want is the glory, not the responsibility.

And what I noticed too is that the fear-mongering—like the propaganda campaign was heavy. And of course, at the beginning, everyone was talking about, "Well, we don’t have enough hospital beds" and blah, blah, blah.

And I’m looking like it’s 24/7. My radio station became the 24/7 COVID information station. And I’m thinking with all the money that you’re putting into marketing and ads and on posters and all this stuff, if we put that into our health care system—which they didn’t have a problem—no, no increase in ICU capacity.

No, nothing that would have actually, in principle, addressed—well, the problem that didn’t exist to begin with but certainly that.

No development of ICU—what did Canada spend—hundreds of millions of dollars on portable ICU beds that were never even implemented, right?

They just sit in a warehouse with warehouse storage costs. I can't remember how many hundreds of millions of dollars is spent on that—some appalling amount, right? So all the money was poorly targeted; they never went after the actual problem.

Nope! Yeah, it just didn’t make sense.

Everybody that I talked to, excuse me, whether they were on the side where they thought COVID was going to be the end of all humanity or whether they thought COVID didn’t even exist, everyone said to me, "Something doesn’t feel right," and that was their intuition.

Intuition, and that stuck with me. And because it didn’t feel right to me either, and yeah, so I just started following these doctors and looking things up for myself instead of just listening to what the—I mean, I stopped believing in the 2016 American election. I quit basically watching the news.

And you know, that’s about when the legacy media finally got corrupted.

Right, and I mean, part of that is because they’re facing such an onslaught of competition from the online media—well, from the online media, essentially they’re going to die.

As you can see that happening, Canada and CTV and Bell Media laid out all sorts of journalists yesterday, including top journalists, right?

And so—and they certainly deserved their demise, like nobody’s business, but it’s part of the inevitable triumph of the distributed media because there’s no way the old legacy media outlets can compete with them, and they started losing their best people and then competing on the clickbait front.

And, you know, it’s just a degenerative spiral, and we’re seeing that play out.

Yes, we are.

It’s a travesty. So now you’re still in Manitoba while this is happening?

Yes, I was actually—my husband and I just moved back to—we both got offered our jobs back in October of 2021, and we moved back to Alberta, and both went back to work at the end of November, and then we moved into our new house a week before Christmas.

And then two weeks later, the convoy started, so it was kind of funny. Even when I got back, it looked like two college kids had just moved into this house and dropped everything, and because I was obviously gone for a while.

And yeah, so we went back to work, and then in the middle of January, my friend Cindy sent me a TikTok video that Chris Barber had done—this is January what year?

January 2022.

2022, yes.

Where Chris was advocating for—he had a massive TikTok following, I guess that’s a trucker thing—TikTok, and he was calling for a Canada-wide shutdown, just wherever you are, shut off your trucks, don’t move.

And Bridget Belton, who is a trucker from Wallaceburg, I think it’s Wallaceburg, Ontario, had reached out to him too because she was having issues crossing the border already.

So why were the truckers upset specifically?

There was more crossing issues, but why are the truckers in particular? Because after two years of our Prime Minister calling them heroes and likening them to soldiers going off to war, he decided to implement the cross-border trucker mandate.

So unless they had a vaccine passport, they would have to quarantine for 14 days. So you’re especially in Ontario, where they’re always—some people are doing this every day. How do you feed your family if you can only—if you have to take 14 days off every time you cross the border? It’s impossible!

So these people—these blue-collar heroes, I call them—he had propped up and complimented and sang their praises from the rooftop, suddenly became public enemy number one, and that was it for them.

And that’s telling because I’m telling you they went for the healthcare workers and the doctors, and I thought for sure just like my speech, somebody was going to say something.

They came after the RCMP, and I was like, "Somebody's got to say something!" And then the military, and then the education system, and all of a sudden, there are all these mandates, and nobody was saying anything.

And finally, when they came for the truckers, they were like, "No, no, this is not acceptable!"

So I got that TikTok from Cindy about Chris, and I actually messaged her because there had been a convoy that came out here in 2019 that was advocating for our energy industry. And I said, "Well, what do you think about another convoy?"

And she’s like, "Well, it didn’t really accomplish much the first time." And I said, "Yeah, you’re right."

And then I messaged a friend of mine in Manitoba, and I said, "What do you think about a convoy to Ottawa?" And he said the same thing.

So in the meantime—

So what was it about the convoy idea you think that was attracting you?

I mean, you’re pursuing it with some degree of fervor even though in your own admission, the last time it occurred, it wasn’t that helpful.

Why do you think that idea?

Because you needed to bring it to Parliament! I’ve seen rallies at the ledge in Alberta, Regina, and all the provinces. I’ve seen rallies—massive protests everywhere—the mainstream media was not reporting them, and nothing was changing.

So we needed to get to Ottawa. And in the meantime, you know, Chris and Bridget and another group had been talking—should they do slow rolls or a shutdown?

And kind of collectively, basically what it was was a very small group of people that had a lot of similar ideas that knew something had to happen. And so I called up Chris, and we discussed the convoy to Ottawa, and I said, "My background is logistics organization administration. You’re going to need social media, and you’re going to need money!"

I'll start you a Facebook page, a Twitter account, and I'll set up a GoFundMe account.

At that time, I didn’t know that GoFundMe was as left-leaning as they were.

Oh, I should let everybody know too— uh, Tamara, under constraint by the Canadian government, is no longer allowed to engage in social media.

Yes, do you want to talk about the restrictions that have been placed?

That's one of my conditions—one of my very broad conditions. I am not allowed to log into my accounts, post to my accounts, or ask anybody to post on my behalf. If I do, I go directly back to jail!

Right, so you’re essentially muzzled on electronic communication.

Yes!

Yes, now why can you do a podcast like this?

Well, after the POEC report came down, and I just could not stand to listen to Justin Trudeau tell people how he had their backs and he was keeping them safe anymore because my head was going to explode.

Keith and I went through my conditions very carefully. Very carefully.

We like—I was taking—it sounds stupid, but I was taking words out, and I was rearranging the sentences to see if there was any possible way that I could be arrested for speaking.

And what we concluded was that so long as I am not organizing a protest or advocating for a protest, exercising my freedom of assembly, basically, it's okay.

Now, how is it that it's possible for your right to freely assemble to be—and your right to freely speak? Obviously, how is it possible even that that’s been abrogated?

What have you been charged with?

Let’s start with—I’ve been charged with mischief, counseling to commit mischief, intimidation, counseling intimidation, and I believe the other one is obstruct a police officer and disobey a court order, I think, which would be the emergencies act, I'm assuming.

And which of those was the core charge?

It was the mischief to begin with.

That's right. So think about that, everyone. That was the initial charge; it’s not mischief, which is, you know, not one of the world’s most serious charges, even though that can be relevant at some time.

But counseling to commit mischief, which is like the derivative of a crime, right? So I don’t even know what that means, but I guess you’re going to find out because they’re going to drag you through court.

How much time have you spent in jail?

48 days!

Well, 49 days, 48 nights!

Right!

And on what grounds precisely? Why why did they hold you?

Oh, well, originally I was denied bail because the judge, Judge Bourgeois, who we found out later was a former Liberal candidate and French—we found out later she was a former Liberal candidate, yes.

Yes, yes.

This is Canada! Yes!

Right, she was, and she didn’t recuse herself from the case because it wasn’t a political case.

So that’s right, yeah!

And oddly enough, like Chris Barber was arrested just before me, and he had his bail hearing and was just sent home.

And then, of course, it was a long weekend; it was family weekend, and so we didn’t have my decision heard until Tuesday morning. But by then, she’d watched this entire violent, horrific takedown of the convoy protest on TV.

And so when I came in, she went upside one of UPS, one upside went up one side of me and down the other and basically said I was a menace to society and a danger to her community.

She said, "My community!" 12 times.

Where is she located?

Oh, she’s—I see, so you were—you were honking her into his feet!

Yes, yeah! I know a lot of—there were a lot of the hot bourgeois in Ottawa who didn’t take kindly to being honked at.

It's traumatizing!

You know, they have people whose lives have been destroyed coming, you know, peacefully complain about it after being oppressed by dimwit moralizers for two years.

Which was frustrating because, you know, we didn’t want—we definitely didn’t want to upset the Ottawa residents; that was never our intention.

But you have to have some level of disruption. But for me to hear people talking about honking horns when we just drove across Canada, and I had people every single day and still to this day telling me they were planning to take their own lives or that they had family members that had already taken their own lives or that they were living in their car.

They lost their business; they couldn’t go kiss their mom goodbye before she died?

And you’re going to complain to me about honking horns? Are you kidding me?

And to—so for me, that was a real eye-opener because, you know, of course, we always know that there’s the laptop class is what we call them now.

But it was really the sense in some cases—not all of them, because there are some beautiful, lovely people in Ottawa. We had a lot of support from Ottawa residents and a lot of federal government employees, but it was almost a sense of like, how dare you blue-collar workers with your dirty hands come and set up and your ability to do things?

That’s the most annoying part of blue-collar people; they’re good at doing things.

Yeah, that’s really hard on people who can only think abstractly because they like to think they live in some sort of, what would you say, privileged moral universe where their ability to deal with abstractions is what constitutes real.

And then they always end up depending on those bloody blue-collar people whenever anything needs to be done; it’s very, very annoying.

Yes, yes.

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So shortly after we got there, there was an injunction order, so we did have to stop honking horns. And honestly, the majority of us at the core organizers were relieved because it was getting to be a bit much.

And you know, when you’ve got like speakers up on stage and people are still honking their horn, you can’t hear them!

Right, so that was good.

Ugly, I mean we’re glad that it stopped for the most part, but again, not all of them stop because you're talking this was not—there was no bosses.

This was a completely organic movement. These truckers just showed up; they’re very strong people, they’re independent thinkers.

You know, they have a lot of responsibility on their shoulders. A lot of them are business owners, so they’re going to do what they’re going to do.

I mean Tamara Leach wasn’t good if they were the sort of people who could be told what to do; they wouldn’t have been in Ottawa with that.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

So let’s go back to when you were envisioning this. So you were starting to think about a convoy. How did it actually start to come about?

Miraculously!

So we started—I got the Facebook page going, got the GoFundMe going, and then we had road captains from every province. So what those were were truckers, normally in like Northern Saskatchewan, Southern Saskatchewan, Northern Alberta, Southern Alberta, and they organized their friends and truckers to come and then we would just all meet along the highway.

So one of mine—

How over what period of time was this organized?

How long?

10 days!

10 days! Wow, that’s fast, right?

Well, so that obviously shows that like it was right—it was time because everybody clamored on board right away, right?

Which shocked us! I mean, and we recognized within 24 hours— in my head, my vision, I thought we’d maybe raise $20,000, a few truckers would drive across Canada, stand there with some signs, hop back in their trucks, and come home.

So within 24 hours, we had over $100,000 in donations already.

And the—and so with my experience with the Maverick party, I was like, “I need a finance committee! Boom!”

So I got some volunteers, we created a finance committee, and then I was also monitoring our social media.

Why did you do that?

Because the fundraiser was set up with my name on it. It was important to me that Canadians that were donating a—had a sense of who I was because that's a lot of money. They were trusting me essentially with their money, and I wanted to explain the whole process—like how we were going to be accountable and transparent.

I had two bookkeepers on the committee, and we had an accounting advisor, an accountant from Medicine Hat, and I just—and it was their money, so it was their decision.

Like, you know, I wanted to let everybody feel like they had a say in this; basically, I was running the government-type sale or running this organization, I guess, how I thought the government should be run, you know, open and transparent.

And I just wanted everyone to be at ease that we were going to follow through and we were going to keep them informed every step of the way.

So tell us what happened on the GoFundMe front.

Yeah, so I didn’t know a lot about GoFundMe when I started the campaign. I just knew it was a big crowdfunding source, and so I set up a GoFundMe to start collecting donations, and as we were—well, obviously, I mean, the money just started pouring in.

And it became very clear to me right away that they were kind of dragging their feet—GoFundMe—in releasing the money.

Okay, so because they’d send an email with, you know, three questions on it. We’d answer those questions, then we’d get an email with five questions on it, and we’d answer those questions.

And it just was this constant back and forth for about two weeks. Finally, when we got to Ottawa the Thursday right after the lawyers all arrived, we had a meeting with all of our lawyers, GoFundMe, their lawyers, and our accountant, and it was great. They were going to release everything.

They were happy with all of our answers, and we woke up the next morning, and they had frozen our camp.

How much money was in at that point?

$10 million!

Who froze it?

GoFundMe, because the city of Ottawa and the Ottawa city police had contacted them and said that we were terrorists, basically.

I see.

Oh yes, well, yes! Right?

So who’s the blame on then? Is the blame on GoFundMe, or is the blame on the people who called you terrorists?

I would say both! I would say both.

The ironic thing is, is that we've watched the Black Lives Matter protests. I watched the CHAZ, the autonomous zone that they had set up in Seattle.

And at some of these protests, like people got raped, they were murdered, businesses were looted, and burnt to the ground—

Yeah, but that wasn’t a good customer!

That’s right! That was for a good cause!

That’s right!

Right?

That wasn’t, like, Confederate flag-waving Canadians, Nazis—by the way, for everyone watching and listening, there are no Confederate flag-waving Canadian Nazis; that’s not a thing.

Nobody waves the Confederate flag in Canada; most Canadians don’t even know what the hell the Confederate flag is. And Nazis, that’s just not a Canadian thing, so that’s all a complete bloody, 100% absolutely reprehensible lie.

That almost all the money that was going into the trucker convoy was American, Make America Great Again Republican types who wanted to overthrow the Canadian government because, of course, everyone knows that’s what Republican Americans want, because they don’t like democracy in Canada.

Whereas the truth of the matter is most Americans don’t even know where the hell Canada is, and the ones that do know really don’t care, and they’re certainly not agitating, especially on the Republican side, to overthrow Canadian democracy.

And they also—the government also intimated that it was being funded by Russians. Yeah, right.

So if it wasn’t Russians, it was Mega Americans, because, you know, the Russians and the Mega Americans, they’re obviously exactly the same people, and they’re all profoundly interested in producing a January 6th type insurrection in Ottawa.

So that was $20 million that was essentially seized in one way or another, yes, by various branches of the Canadian government.

Right. Now you said there’s some of that money that’s still around, I think?

Yes, there is!

So when Jacob and Give, send Go, refunded the gifts and go money, there was about $3 million that was stuck in the payment processor, Stripe.

So that was seized, and that’s now an escrow. There was—we had just over $400,000 in e-transfers because right away when I set up the GoFundMe, people were messaging me saying—

That’s right!

So that was kind of my first concern. I was like, "Oh geez, I probably should have looked into this a little bit more." But what do you do? Live and learn!

Yeah, so we’re accustomed to operating on trust; that’s why our societies are rich—yes, because you can generally operate on trust, or you could.

Yes, right, so far, so far.

Yes, yeah, so that money also went into the escrow account, and then a gentleman by the name of Chris Guerra had started an organization. We had a Ground Zero team we called it in Ottawa that was getting everything—all the infrastructure in place for when we arrived, like food, showers, hotel rooms.

How many people did come to the convoy? How many truckers were there? Do you know approximately?

I have no idea!

Where did they come from?

They came from all over! They came from the coast of BC; they came from the coast of Newfoundland; they came from the Northwest Territories. We had Americans that came up and joined us, and that was funny because, you know, we had a finance committee in place, so we put procedures and processes in place so that this would all be accountable, and we had all these—and so one of my jobs was going to be to stand at the gas pumps and record every trucker that came through with their truck number and their name and their receipts, which in the first day was not even possible.

And one of my other jobs was to get truck counts every day, but that was impossible because the situation was that a lot of people couldn’t go all the way to Ottawa, so they would join us for like 100 kilometers or a province, or, you know, they’d get to the Manitoba border.

So we always had people coming and going.

What did you see when you came across?

Oh please, tell me—the most beautiful show of humanity and the unity I’ve ever seen.

I’ve never seen anything like it after all these years of, you know, especially living under this prime minister who has tried to constantly divide people by race, religion, culture, income bracket, geographical location, gender, gender identity, yes.

So, we were coming through Manitoba, we were coming through Headingley, and it was the most massive crowd I’ve ever seen, and there were native drummers on the side of the road, dressed in their full regalia, and standing beside them were like Forsyth gentlemen and standing beside them were hutterite women with their children holding signs: "Thank you for giving us back our future!"

And beside them were nuns in full habits, and you know when the nuns are protesting that things aren’t good—that’s right!

And the Hutterites, right, right, absolutely!

They’re not known for their political—I’d seen them all the way from Medicine Hat—all the way through Manitoba.

And I found out after because my dad’s great friends with a lot of the colonies down there that they would go to one intersection on the Salt Lake Back Road, watch us go by, hop in their vans or trucks, and they did this to just watch us, you know? Yes, yes, and support, and it was just incredible because it didn’t matter. None of your background even mattered, right?

We were just Canadians, right?

For once—come on, you know? And what sort of distances were people driving?

Because lots of people watching and listening don’t know how big Canada is, so you said from Medicine Hat to Ottawa was what, 36 hours?

36 hours! I think that’s about 3,500 kilometers, and so which is quite a long way.

But we had people—the clan mothers that joined us came from the Northwest Territories.

And they had—there were truckers that had come from the Northwest Territories and the East Coast, Newfoundland, New Brunswick, Nova Scotia.

This was truly a Canadian movement! Like we had people from everywhere!

Northwest Territories?

Yeah, I didn’t know that.

Yes, yes!

Which shows you that people, like you said earlier, were ready.

Well, and desperate.

I mean, the thing is that for—the truckers— first of all, this was in the middle of this—is in the middle of the winter, right? Right?

And that’s winter. It was -20 in Ottawa for most of that, yes?

Yeah, and then those truckers were taking their rigs out of service for what, two weeks?

Something like that!

Some of them longer—three weeks, right? Which is a major economic hit. You have to be driven to some degree of desperation, and it's not like Canadian truckers, like Dutch farmers, are known for their political activism.

I mean, they’ve never been a politically active class in Canada. There’s no history of even labor agitation on the trucker side in Canada.

So the fact that it was them that finally had enough is really telling.

Well, just like it is telling on the Dutch farmers’ scene, right?

And the yellow jackets, to some degree. I mean, the French are a lot more volatile with their political demonstrations, but Canada doesn’t have a history of this. This isn’t something that ever happens here, just like it never happens in the Netherlands.

And so, all right, so you’re driving down the road, and you’re seeing all these people, and this thing is like ballooned like mad, way beyond what you would have initially envisioned.

Yes, and you’re on your way to Ottawa! What happens when you get to Ottawa?

We pulled up onto the hill—well, we got into Iron Pryor on the Friday night, and Saturday, we drove up around noon. We met at noon, drove into Ottawa, and the crowds—all the way from Iron Pryor right into Ottawa—were amazing!

The overpasses were filled with people, and it was just so beautiful, and we got up there, and there were massive crowds up on Parliament Hill too.

And so when we got out, I mean, it was just—by now, people knew who Chris and I were, so there were lots of people coming up and asking for photos and talking to us and stuff, and it was—it was so surreal!

Yes, yeah.

And you know, Chris and I talked on the way out, and we didn’t have a plan for when we got there. I mean, just getting there was such a massive undertaking.

And I mean, kudos to Chris; he led that convoy.

Chris is in jail.

Barber? Nope, he’s not. He’s back home in Saskatchewan.

Okay, so let’s walk through that briefly—who ended up jailed?

Chris was arrested and in prison for one evening. I was arrested and in jail for 18 days. Pat King was arrested and he was in jail for five months.

He was the leader!

Yeah, he was involved in it.

He wasn’t the leader of it, but—

And yeah, I was actually in jail last summer when he was finally released.

Finally! But there are still people in jail, this year, there are still people in jail.

Yes!

Of all the Coots boys are going through their pre-trial right now. I mean, they weren’t affiliated with us; that was all, you know, separate groups and stuff.

But I mean, what’s happening there is just unbelievable to those guys.

And Aaron Aldrich was another one— I don’t know if you’ve ever seen the photos, but there’s a gentleman in lots of pictures with a toque and a big belly. He never wore a shirt, always smoking cigarettes, and that was Aaron.

And he just had—he’s finally back in Alberta, I think he went back last week. He was—he got out of jail when I was on my way out for the inquiry in the fall and he had to stay there with his surety until last week. He hasn’t seen his mom since 2022!

Oh yeah, okay, so what’s happened now—in Ottawa you have all these trucks gathered. There’s hundreds of them or there are thousands of them by this point, right?

So everybody’s shocked at the magnitude of this, including the Ottawa bourgeoisie, who aren’t very happy with all the honking.

There’s a lawsuit about that, eh?

That you’re also facing a $400 million class-action suit?

Yes, right, because of the economic harm caused by the trucker convoy?

Yes, right, not the two years of business collectors and shutdowns and locked in your home—right?

And do you think that there was a deleterious impact of the trucker convoy on businesses in Ottawa?

Absolutely not!

We never told them to shut down; it was the city that advised them to shut down because they had to have painted us as hooligans and thugs before we even arrived!

Yeah, yeah, I mean fascists and penetrated by the Russians, yeah, yeah.

And the MAGA types! That’s right!

Forget about them, there was a Black Rocks report that just came out, I think it was the week before last, it was a Public Safety health safety Canada memo that was sent out internally to all these businesses saying that we were entering federal buildings and causing damage and disruption, which was a bold-faced lie!

Just nasty lies—nasty, nasty lies!

And why? Because we don’t have—and I said this in my testimony—when you lead a country, you do not get to pick and choose who you lead. You are responsible for every single person in that country whether you believe in what they believe or not, right?

You don’t get to call them names!

I mean now our prime minister is calling parents all right—because they want to know—far-right, even worse—that’s right!

Do you think that you should be able to have the last say in relationship to what your children are being taught in school?

And now you’re essentially a Nazi because of course that’s what far-right means!

That’s right, right! So that means our Prime Minister now believes that if you believe that you should put your child’s interests as the paramount concern of your life, that you’re essentially far-right.

And so if Canadians had any sense, which I’m afraid generally they don’t, they would listen to that because he’s actually serious about what he’s claiming.

So we know that what the New Brunswick Premier came out and made it illegal for schools to use gender-transforming pronouns without parental—without informing the parents, which seems like the minimal thing they could do—and Trudeau pilfered him!

But the vast majority of Canadians agree with the New Brunswick Premier’s statement, and if they were informed, a lot more of them would agree because Canadians, as a general rule, don’t pay much attention to politics and don’t know what’s going on.

If they actually knew what was going on, a hell of a lot more Canadians would agree with the New Brunswick Premier.

Yeah, so I know, kudos to him, like who saw that coming out of New Brunswick? I know, I know!

He grew a spine!

Canada, they’re starting to rediscover their spines!

That gives me something!

Yeah, well, you have Danielle Smith and Scott Moe who look like they’ve got some spines and Peter Polly have might have one as well and the premier of New Brunswick, right?

That came out of right field, you might say.

Yeah, yeah, that’s right.

That’s really encouraging to me.

All right, so you’re in Ottawa and we’re all watching this from the outside. I was on tour with Tammy at that time; we would have liked to have come to Ottawa. Did you speak at one of the events electronically?

Yes! And so, but we’re watching from the outside and what we see from the outside is that despite the fact that you’re being painted as misogynist, racist, bigot, MAGA, Confederate flag-waving fascists, there is like no violence.

There are children there; the bloody government conspired to threaten the truckers with the removal of their children, which was one of the most reprehensible acts I’d ever seen the Canadian government commit—it might be number one.

Freezing your bank accounts—that’d be the contender for top place, but the idea that the government would threaten those protesters with the removal of their children by social services—that was crossing the line in a big way there, boy!

But that’s what they did! The whole time, it was all—it was all constant provocation.

And what’d the OPP have to do with—the OPP were—yes.

Yes, yes! So obviously right away, when we recognized before we left how how much support we were getting, you know, I said we need to let our local police departments know when we’re coming through so they can make arrangements and everything, and so that's what we did.

And the OPP were just the most amazing organization to deal with. They were very organized; they were professional; they were polite; they were supportive.

And I’ll firmly believe if we could have dealt with the OPP for the whole duration of this thing, it would not have ended the way that it did.

And out of the inquiry, what I learned was besides the OPP, we were the most organized and professional organization out of them all.

Well, you were right-wing.

Yeah! Those left-wingers, they have a hard time organizing!

Yes, these right-wingers, we’re pretty good at keeping things straight!

Yeah, that’s right, and they were just—they were wonderful!

And we have a—we had a phone call from a gentleman called Officer Pierre; he was, I think, he was French but he was OPP. The night after the raids, because the first thing they did was they raided Coventry, which was where we had a lot of supplies and donations and a lot of trucks parked.

And they went in there, and they had snipers on the roof, and they stole food; they stole fuel; they stole firewood, whatever they could take, basically.

Now remember, this is minus 30, right, in Ottawa, right?

I lived there; it’s cold!

In fact, it is colder than it is in Alberta, really!

It’s cool because it’s huge—it’s cold! You don’t last outside! And then they started taking the jerry cans, which is when, yeah, I mean, this is the beautiful thing, like I was saying last night about Canadians.

He calls us a fringe minority; what do Canadians do? Everyone’s got a t-shirt or a tattoo or a hat or a bumper sticker. Like, they owned it!

Like now we're proudly the fringe minority, right?

And they said that they were going to confiscate jerry cans, and so Canadians came out in hordes with empty jerry cans!

Yes! Was that spontaneous?

Totally spontaneous! Nobody organized that; they just started showing up! Some of them were empty, some of them were full of water, like some of them had fuel in them, but because they were threatening to start charging people that were bringing it in with mischief.

Yeah, and again, Canadians just took that and ran with it, you know?

That’s a fashion show on the stage, you know? So it was brilliant!

So, now what’s happening?

Okay, so what’s happening as the protest progresses? What’s the mood in downtown Ottawa? And what’s actually going on?

You have a center stage or a couple of center stages set up, and there are people speaking.

Tell us a little bit about what you would have experienced being there.

It was like Canada Day on steroids!

It was the most beautiful, loving, healing atmosphere ever!

I mean strangers were hugging and crying on each other’s shoulders, and people were singing "Oh Canada!"

And you know, flying our flags so proudly finally! It was a beautiful, beautiful atmosphere!

Which was not what the mainstream media, of course, was reporting.

But it was very jubilant, very happy!

The thing that struck me the most though was, you know, people would come up to me and hug me and cry on my shoulder and tell me their story and, you know, thank us for what we were doing.

But it was the immigrants who, when they came up to me, had this look of desperation in their eyes—like nothing I have ever seen before. It was gut-wrenching, you know?

And because they’ve lived through this. They’ve watched all these signs, and now they escaped Poland, Russia, Iran, Romania, Eastern Europe, China, you know, people under despotism!

That’s right!

People that have escaped communist countries!

Yeah!

And I’m telling you, the look in their eyes was—yeah!

Yeah, we’ve seen that look in Eastern Europe plenty.

Yeah, yeah, because the Eastern Europeans, they’re not very happy with all the woke nonsense they see enveloping the west!

You know, when we've gone through Eastern Europe, they tell us consistently, it's like, "What the hell are you people doing? Don’t you know what that did for us for 70 years? You’re walking down exactly the same pathway!"

How can you possibly be so blind?

It’s like, "Yeah, yeah!"

Well, they remember, man! Communism, yeah. It’s particular!

Yeah, let's do it again! That was particularly germane to Albania because that was the worst of the Congress countries!

Me too! They were under lockdown until 1992; that’s only 30 years!

Yeah! Yeah, they found a—they found a hundred-room bunker, like a hundred yards, an underground hundred-room bunker a hundred yards away from their Parliament building five years ago.

No one even knew that was there—that the Defense Minister had built in secret at the height of the belief in Albania that Albania was the center country of the world, and that everyone was just waiting to invade because everyone wanted what the Albanians had!

We went out on a boat into the ocean along the Albanian coast, and we could see these little things that looked like small adobe houses up in the hills—were huge!

Yeah!

Well, you couldn’t see them because they were three-quarters of the way up the mountains, and they were tunnels into the mountain!

So they spent all their nation’s money on underground tunnels and tunnels into the mountain because they had to be careful because the world was after them.

And then the people of the country had nothing—nothing!

That’s communism!

Yeah, yeah!

Albania!

Yeah, well, they remember; they remember fear. Fear and tyranny, boy—that's for sure!

All under the guise of compassion and morality—yeah, which is the epidemic we’re facing in the West!

Well, it is! I mean, we’re basically crafting legislation and policy on hurt feelings for false moral reasons.

All right, so you’re having a big celebration in Ottawa, and the legacy media are trying to paint you as misogynists and fascists and bigots, and so is the punitive leader of Canada, and you actually manage, God only knows how you did this, to keep that entire enterprise both peaceful and positive, right?